First of all, the links on the main page are backwards, the Days of Love takes you to the Amusment Park page, and Vice Versa,
Second,
Are these games cut or uncut?
Perhaps a third question to ask is, have they actually been released or is it still delayed slightly in when those that ship them to us will have them to ship?
well theres alot of questions i wanna ask on these titles, but the 1 i asked and the 1 you asked were the 2 i actually wanted to know most.
I seem to remember someone posted previously mentioning that the games have a lot of the H-scenes edited down or edited out, similar to how they did that in Phantom, but never sure if that has been confirmed.
Just remembered reading on the Peach Princess front page they have not yet gotten the DVD games to ship it seems,to quote “Then you can preorder the two new interactive DVD games by Hirameki International, Day of Love and Amusement Park, which are supposed to come in any day now.”
So how long is this delay suppose to last?
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 02-20-2004).]
Actually I have order LMM but since a long time ago there has never been a mentioned release date. Hence the difference here, where they are proudly announcing it is already out, just not anywhere to be bought or shipped yet, see the irony of sorts?
Which one Tea Society of a Witch , Hourglass of Summer or the one they took off the list?
Yes these titles are HEAVILY edited (all nudity has been edited out) I reccomend that no one buys any games from Hirameki International As they pretty much butcher them for a North American Release. It makes me sick.
While I agree, as can be seen in long messages other posts, that I don’t like the editing, censorship, I must grudingly admit they are so far the only ones bringing these games across in any format. If they become popular in this format there is a chance the unedited might someday make it across, so with some grievance against the editing they do, I still will support them with the games they release.
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 02-20-2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by woodelf:
Hourglass of Summer is the one I was thinking of but I could not remember the name at the time. Tea Society of a Witch does interest me too.
I have not heard much of Hourglass of Summer but what I have heard puts it as one I want to get when it is released. Maybe having heard more about Tea Society of a Witch that is one I am more eager to play, in some way even more so then the ones they are currently releasing.
Not to fuel the fire, but I think the bigger issue and concern is not who edits the game so much as they are edited, censored, whichever, and that is what bothers people. In the case of editing and censorship who becomes less important then the fact it has happened, once more this is not to add fuel to the fire, just to voice my own thought over why no one cares who did the editing.
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 02-20-2004).]
I dont care Who edited them.
I would still prefer the non-edited versions.
I dont have anything against this company either, Im still going to play the games because they sound interesting. Its just that I have preferences, and I would like Hirameki to know them; perhaps in the future they can licence the adult versions for translation instead.
quote:
Originally posted by Jason4:
They INTENDED for their games to be released this way.
Now if 3rd parties (such as government, ultra-conservatives, etc.) tried to have the games censored, I would have a problem with that.
Then there is the question of forced intent, did they do it because they want to, or for some reason, had to censor them, and in this case it is censoring. I am censoring ideas from the masses because a group, even a large group, might be offended, but for those that won't be the ideas are censored.
If I go back and delete the last sentece to place a different one there or because it does not fit that is editing, if I take out a bunch H-Scenes because people would be offended by them and I would not sell this, that is censorship.
Once more this is not to fuel the fire, just to state an opinion on the difference between the two concepts and how censorship is not limited to the governments or ruling bodies,how these games have had aspects censored in the editing of the games, and how anyone can get something removed and if that prevents others from enjoying it, they are engaged in a form of censorship.
Back to topic, a thought I forgot, does anyone know when these will be truly avialable to ship for those of us that have ordered/preorderd?
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 02-21-2004).]
I shall make it clear that I too know the word censorship to mean as it was taught to me, blame a very Liberal Quaker upbringing if you desire, but Censorship Exists Whenever:
1) Anyone, be it a company, a group, or a powerful individual ‘edits’, censors, games which therefore deny’s knowledge, information,ideas or possible additional enjoyment, perhaps in some cases all four though here perhaps just the fourth, to even a minority in order to please the majority in this case to make more money from the majority.
2)It does not truly matter their reasons because by editing they are engaged in a form of censorship of information, knowledge, ideas, additional enjoyment to a group of people, even if those buying these games in their first form are the overall minority.
3) If the original came out first and then an ‘edited’ or more correctly ‘censored’ copy comes out that is censorship because they are truly denying knowledge, information, ideas, enjoyment to a group of people.
For the record it is a lot harder to edit, censor H-scenes (or any other idea, knowledge, belief or concept) out of games (or any other form of media) that did not have them originally, so I am not sure how point one fits since to have something and remove it thus denying it and it’s meaning to a group of people is a form of censorship of your own work for whatever cause, while to add it is to expand that work.
4)Ah but what greater outside pressure is there in this world to a company then money in any form? That though does come from other people. Those that refuse to buy these games deny the people money and thus pressure them to censor their own works. Often it is because the majority would be or has proven to be offended buy this stuff. If they are not offended they are more likely to buy it, but if such ideas have to be hidden, age restricted, etc, it is more likely to offend thus smaller income, thus their need to censor.
However, as you said this is circles, you see it one way I see it another and trust me, for a Liberal thinker I can be quite obstinate when I believe myself to be correct in my terminology as I do in this case.
Once more, back to topic, does anyone know when these games will be someone they can ship from?
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 02-22-2004).]
SCDawg: as I understand it, the key point you seem to be missing is that the unedited versions were still available and offered to customers at the same time the edited ones were. If the customers still had the choice to buy the full versions (if they want the completeness), or alternatively to buy the edited versions (if they find sex scenes in games distasteful like a number of my friends), then how can it be denying anyone anything?
(Please forgive me if I’ve got my facts wrong. The above is my understanding of the situation.)
And I have no more info than anyone else about these games. I’m just eagerly awaiting them, because if the translated versions work well then I should finally have a tool to convince the above-mentioned friends towards bishoujo games. Currently they won’t even try Brave Soul, for example, because of the tiny tiny fraction of the game that’s sex scene…
The point you seem to be missing, SCDawg, is that censorship involves the use of force and removing access to something that would otherwise be available. When a Japanese AV producer is required by law to add mosaics to a film or risk having it seized or going to jail for it, that’s properly called censorship. When an American movie studio edits an X-rated movie for an R-rated release, it’s done to reach a wider audience. There’s no law requiring them to edit it. They can even release both versions, if they choose.
A game’s copyright owners may insist that it be published in an unedited form if they desire, but that might result in nobody wanting to publish it. It may be seen as an unprofitable venture. So the publisher suggests edits and the owners agree because both want it to be released. Neither party is coerced. In the end, people get to see something that they might otherwise never get to see at all. In a case where editing is done purely for business reasons, it’s a real stretch to call that censorship.
No, as I was taught it Censorship does NOT always involve the use of force in terms of law, military, governmental, military, majority or church related pressures, albeit those are main ways force can occur. It can also involved a brainwashed mass that believes it is right to ‘edit’ for the sake of having the ‘edited’ information reach a larger audience, and though it is debatable as to if that is occurring here and to what level should it be occurring here something I don’t want to start a debate upon. Yet what is the real reason they censor the X-Rated movies and such games? Simply to reach a wider audience. What causes them to choose to do that? The fact they are forced to by their desire for more money. Their desires force them to censor their own works.
Money is a force and in some ways a threat of economic force because people basically threaten them to censor the work or they will not buy it. It is little different then the days they had to censor Huck Finn for the ‘cusses’ to get it in school libraries and sold in some bookstores, which they still have to do in some places today.
Also having a copy in another language “unedited”, uncensored, does not mean the game is uncensored in any language but that one. It is censored in at least one language, how many of us can read Japanese enough to enjoy a game, know what is going on, and not have to guess a large amount of time? How many of us that play this game here or elsewhere, can read Japanese? So long as one form is edited to use your word, censored to use mine, it is denying something to a group of people that cannot read or do not have the time to learn a rather complex, (as I am learning first hand) second language.
Ironically, and this is why I do not desire to get into such discussions as well, I will be trying the games, but that does not mean I think what was done was editing and not censorship. As I said I am obstante when I believe myself right, particularly on such issues as censorship, I never really if ever change my opinion, which is why I really did not want to open this can or worms, I believe I am right and will not change my opinion, because I think based on my upbringing and personal feelings what they are doing is censorship of their own work at the outside force of wanting more money and fear of not getting the money by offending, alienating etc, the majority of the people. Whatever the reason, in at least one language it is a work that has been censored and irregardless of by who or for what reasons it is a work they censored perhaps their own, in order to conceivably reach a larger audience thus make more money.
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 02-23-2004).]
You guys don’t know anything about the upcoming games, nor about how the bishoujo console gaming world and the bishoujo PC gaming world work, right?
1) “Hourglass of Summer” was FIRST a console non-adult game. It was THEN ported on PC. So much for the “editing” stuff.
2) It’s common for adult PC games to be ported on consoles. They will in the process have their adult contents removed BUT will win features, such as additional characters, stories or voices. So, if the Hirameki games are from the console ports (as they apparently are), YES, you lose the adult contents, but you WIN some other features. BUT you do have what the Japanese people have, only it’s the console versions.
And, considering how many different (ACTRESS, Chise, MESA, Spi:l/SPIELSOFT, Custom Software, Tarte, Survive/Frontwing, Frontwing and Berries) game makers are represented in Hirameki’s selection of games, STOP complaining… Foremost, when you didn’t even actually TRY any of the games.
Geez…
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“What is love if not painful and tragic? It’s just boring.”
- Elaine Barlow -
[This message has been edited by olf_le_fol (edited 02-23-2004).]
I am not complaining, stating my opinion, and as I said I will try the games, so let’s end this now since I think there are sharp lines on either side and neither side is willing to give an inch, does that sound like a good idea to people?
I’m with you SCDawg
I think that Hirameki is doing good work, and important work. To get the games into the stores (something we’ve not been able to do by and large), they do the PG or PG13 versions of the games based on DVD. Remembering that 99% of people say “dating-sim game, what’s that?” when we tell them about our games, I welcome anything that gets people into the fold of interactive anime games. And the artwork looks great in both titles. They’re in stock now!
quote:
Originally posted by Peter Payne:
They're in stock now!
That's probably the most important thing! [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] Hmm, I wonder if and when I'll see it at places like Sam Goody...