Hey guys, i found this site with a great explanation about bishoujo games, their subgenres, origins, examples, some short reviews and many useful links.
Give a look if you want. Highly recommended to all newbies and newcomers in the bishoujo games world.
http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Bishojo_game
Don’t forget to check the links and reviews for some bishoujo and H-games, too.
A very interesting site. Thanks, Gilis-san!
While perusing the contents, I found a link to another remarkable site that I’d describe as a Japanese b-games of the 80’s museum. It features pictures of cover art from games of that decade and really gives you a sense of the evolution of the genre.
I agree, it’s a really good and in-depth description.
I noticed them mentioning the serial killer Tsutomu Miyazaki, and how the case with him caused widespread opposition to pornographic manga and similar. At another forum I frequent, a Japanese guy mentioned him in a thread where someone asked about how the Japanese themselves look at people who watch anime. The post was pretty good, so I’ll copy/paste it here:
AnimeSuki Forums, 21/07/2004, by kj1980
Yes, I am Japanese. Yes, I am an otaku.
There, that will instantly make me shunned from my co-workers, women, and society if I go out into the street and proclaim that.
Why? Where did this stigmatism for being an otaku come from?
There are numerous of reasons, but most Japanese will have one distinctive and infamous crime that makes them equate “otaku=psycho” in the heads.
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The Tsutomu Miyazaki Case (also known as "The Saitama Prefecture Multiple Child Rape-Murder Case)
Between August 1988 and June 1989, four pre-school school girls became missing in Saitama Prefecture. Here is an overall review of what happened:
August 22, 1988 - Imano Mari (age four) was kidnapped, raped and murdered. Video taped Mari-chan’s corpse and vagina. (video tape found at his house as evidence). Dumped and buried body in forest.
October 3, 1988 - Miyazaki asked Yoshizawa Masami (age seven) for directions, and promised her to take her somewhere “nice.” Masami started crying inside Miyazaki’s car, and Miyazaki: “I had no choice but to strangle her to shut up.” After she took her final breath, Miyazaki: “I took her clothes off and put my finger into her vagina, but her body moved even though she was dead…I became scared I left the body in the forest”
December 9, 1988 - Namba Erika (age four) kidnapped, raped, and strangled. Dumped body in a forest.
December 15, 1988 - Erika’s body found in forest by police investigators.
January, 1989 - Miyazaki returns to Mari-chan’s burial site, took her skull back home, burned it to ashes at his home incinerator. Sends Mari-chan’s ashes to her parents in a cardboard box with a letter enclosed with newspaper letters of ¬Åu¬ê^-¬ù¬ÅE¬à√¢¬ç¬ú¬ÅE¬è√ѬÅE¬è√ò¬ñ¬æ¬ÅE¬ä√ì’√®¬Åv (Mari, Ikotsu, Yaki, Shoumei, Kantei / Mari, Body Ashes, Burned, Evidence, Proof)
February 10, 1989 - Miyazaki sends additional letters to Asahi Daily News and Mari-chan’s distressed families (once again with newspaper letters) explaining in vivid detail how he killed and raped little Mari-chan.
March 11, 1989 - Miyazaki learns of Mari-chan’s funeral. Sends another letter to the Imano family and Asahi Daily News “I deeply appreciate the proper burial that you were able to provide her that I could not.” Public anger explodes.
June 6, 1989 - Nomoto Ayako (age five) kidnapped. Miyazaki: “after she kept on repeatedly inquiring about my deformed hands, I became frustrated and killed her.” Body (minus legs and arms) dumped in forest. Video taped himself masturbating (once again, video tape found at his home later) with Ayako’s hands, then ate them.
July 23, 1989 - As Miyazaki was video taping a crying naked girl (age six) in a forest, he was apprehended by the girl’s father. He was taken to the police station for attempted kidnapping and rape. Miyazaki confesses to his crimes.
Police searches Miyazaki’s house:
over 6000 video tapes of anime, lolita videos, and horror films
numerous photos and video tapes of himself committing the crimes (used as evidence)
Miyazaki Tsutomu - Sentenced to death in 2002. Currently appealing to the Supreme Court. Meanwhile, he had published an autobiography with proceeds going to the victims’ families. Victims’ families refuse such an outrage (duh).
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The above mentioned case was so notorious and shocking to the Japanese public that it set an image that loners and otakus are all fucked up in their minds.
Yes, the act that Miyazaki Tsutomu did was indeed a heinous and atrocious crime…and I support his death as do the majority of the Japanese populace. However, is it fair to say:
“Otakus cannot get real girls, so they settle for 2-dimensional girls and go after little innocent children”
"All otakus are loners because they cannot fit in with society"
because of one otaku who couldn’t distinguish the obvious between right and wrong? No. He was a fucked up loser who just happened to be an otaku. What if he happened to be a biker? Does that mean all bikers are fucked up? Or, the most possible scenario which is the scariest of all - what if he was a socially amiable neighbor who would go out and drink beer with his neighbors?
Unfortunately, people like to label each other as being “with us, our against us.” Hence, thanks to Miyazaki Tsutomu they associate it as “Miyazaki was an otaku, hence all otakus are fucked up.” Congratulations Mr. Miyazaki Tsutomu, you are hated even more since us Japanese otakus despise you because you are the reason that caused us to be branded as “fucked up losers.”
So going back to the question with this aside…"how do Japanese view people who watch anime/manga?"
As your Japanese friend has mentioned, yes we are considered to be “childish losers.” Why? Because of the above mentioned incident.
And of course, Japan is an image conscious society. As I said earlier, the Japanese philosophy of social harmony (or, “wa”) is basically an euphemism in saying “you are with us, or you are not - and if you are not, tough luck.” Hence, I do not openly say that I am an otaku nor avidly remark that I love to watch anime and play ero-games - for the risk of being cold-shouldered by my co-workers and that it may infringe on my advancement…or even worse, being laid off for any reason the corporation may decide to utilize upon me just to get rid of “a psycho that disrupts the harmony of our company.” Perhaps there are several other co-workers in my company that share the same interest in anime and ero-games as I do…but since they don’t go out and proclaim themselves as anime fans and neither do I, we will never know.
Manga is a different story. Manga has been with us since the pre-war days, and were popular back then as four-blocked comics on newspapers spreading propaganda. Later on, Haseda Machiko’s “Sazae-san,” and the Fujimi-sou members mangakas (Tezuka Osamu, Fujiko A/F Fujio, Akatsuka Fujio, Ishinomori Shoutaro, and Tsunoda Jiro) would revitalize the whole manga scene altogether. These people are considered to be national heroes by the populace, and gods by otakus. It is more than enough to say that without them, the multi-billion-yen publishing industry (mainly through manga sales) will not exist today. For otakus, without them, there wouldn’t be the abundance of manga and anime that we see now.
Hence, stigmatism against manga are more relaxed. You see them all lined up on shelfs at bookstores all across Japan. Genres exists aimed at little kids (Koro-Koro Comics) to elementary (Sunday, Jump), middle school and high school (Magazine, Young Jump) to the adult (mangas about playing mahjong and golf, mangas about office life, mangas about dating and getting laid, mangas about how to keep a stable marriage, etc. etc…)
But so do anime - they offer variety. Unfortunately, not all mangas are turned into anime, and not all anime are shown on “normal time.” Compared to the amount of published manga and anime that is shown on TV, manga beats anime handsdown…hundred fold. Compared to 60-70 different anime shows each week…there are over 600-700 different manga being published - from the obviously popular such as Naruto to extremely minor manga on how to taste wine. Manga is more easily accesible and offers a vast amount of variety that it includes genres that even men in their fifties and sixties can enjoy (like how to keep a good posture when playing golf). Manga has assimilated into Japanese literature as it is.
But then, there are exceptions to what society perceived which anime is acceptable to be watched even when you are an adult.
A. "Doraemon"
B. "Sazae-san"
C. anything by Miyazaki Hayao and Studio Ghibli
Reason being, both A & B are animes based on mangas done by national heroes and gods of the manga world - Hasegawa Machiko and Fujiko F. Fujio. C is because Miyazaki Hayao has established himself as a major internationally accepted (and makes very great films too!) director.
So anime is gaining popularity outside of Japan. Even the Japanese government proclaimed that “anime and manga are an important part of Japanese culture.” So several Japanese anime films won kudos at Cannes and Venice. Still, the Japanese populaces’ stance is “anime is for kids, if you still are watching anime as an adult - you are fucked up.”
Once again, thank you Mr. Miyazaki Tsutomu. I hope you have an excrutiating death at the hanging.
That is rather disturbing about serial killer Tsutomu Miyazaki, but also interesting that yet again society takes the most negatively extreme example they can find and labels almost and entire industry by pointing that that negatively extreme example.The guy was a sicko no question about that, and I also agree with the poster that it sucks that almost the entire industry got labeled negatively within Japan because of the actions of one obviously crazy person who was insane enough to first do such horrid acts and then tape himself committing the those acts.
By the way they still hang people in Japan? I thought most “industrial countires” went to the “more humane” electric chair or lethal injection either of which, and this might be the only time I support the death penalty, Tsutomu Miyazaki seems to deserve through his own admissions.
quote:
Originally posted by SCDawg:
That is rather disturbing about serial killer Tsutomu Miyazaki, but also interesting that yet again society takes the most negatively extreme example they can find and labels almost and entire industry by pointing that that negatively extreme example.
Like the recent murders in the US that were blamed on a supposedly stolen video game console, or the kid who murdered his friend after playing "Manhunt", etc etc.
Here in Norway, there was a murder case a few days ago. A man, an immigrant who was originally from Somalia, boarded a tram. There, he pulled put a "Rambo: First Blood" knife and started stabbing people randomly as he was walking to the end of the tram. One man died, several other people were injured. The police managed to capture him about a day later, I believe, and he was saying that he was possessed by evil spirits and such. A few days prior, he had been released from a psychiatric institution here.
Of course, politicians started suggesting we ban knives like the one he used in the murder. Would the disaster have been prevented if that ban had been in place prior to the attack? No, he would probably have bought a normal kitchen knife or similar instead.
Well, at least he hadn't been playing any computer games, so they couldn't blame it on that...
People are fully capable of becoming messed up without the "aid" of computer games (or other media). If anything, they more than likely just decide the shape (and maybe the time) of the act, they don't cause the mental disorders.
[This message has been edited by AG3 (edited 08-11-2004).]
True enough. A knife for hunt is a dangerous thing, but it will not to force anyone to hurt peoples.
I have many knives in my kitchen. Even so, i never felt any “evil spirits” possessing me and demanding me to hurt other peoples.
Weapons don’t kill peoples… peoples (using that weapons) kill peoples.
quote:
Originally posted by Peter Gilis:
Weapons don't kill peoples... peoples (using that weapons) kill peoples.
Unless a gun fires by itself because it fell off the counter from an earthquake and the trigger got caught on those fancy curved handles shooting a person who was just sitting in the morning in the corner waiting at the counter for the other person to pour the coffee. or a clumsy dumb man falls on a knife that fell off the counter from an earthquake and had one of those strange falls where it lands with the handle perpendicular to floor so that the blade is pointing straight up.
I know. I don't really have much constructive things to say lately. :shrugs:
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精神 の 神
People do stupid things. Some people do crazy, disturbed things. They were like that outside of any one influence on them.
But things like this fade over time. If you want an example in the US, go to a public library and look up any of the anti-D&D propaganda literature from 20 years ago. I actually own a copy of a book (got it cheap at a used bookstore) that is a diatribe against the evil corrupting satanic influences of Saturday morning cartoons. (I also have a book by the lunatic who espoused the theory that life on this planet was created by the aliens. It’s positively ridiculous.)
Eventually people’s emotional gut feeling will fade, and they will be more reasonable. This is no consolation to those who are being discriminated against right now.
quote:
Originally posted by AG3:
Here in Norway, there was a murder case a few days ago. A man ... pulled put a "Rambo: First Blood" knife and started stabbing people randomly as he was walking to the end of the tram. One man died, several other people were injured. The police managed to capture him about a day later, I believe, and he was saying that he was possessed by evil spirits and such. A few days prior, he had been released from a psychiatric institution here.Of course, politicians started suggesting we ban knives like the one he used in the murder.
[This message has been edited by AG3 (edited 08-11-2004).]
This is clear cut pandering to the electorate. On behalf of all of Norway I am ashamed of anyone pushing that as a solution. The REAL problem is going to be much harder to deal with, so they picked a nice-sounding issue to rail against to make themselves look good.
The real issue, of course, is that this man should obviously never have been allowed to leave the psychiatric institution. But fixing this would require actual work, and hard work, to get all the various interest groups to agree on a solution. Much easier to blame the convenient scapegoat.
quote:
Originally posted by Nandemonai:
I actually own a copy of a book (got it cheap at a used bookstore) that is a diatribe against the evil corrupting satanic influences of Saturday morning cartoons.
I have never heard this theory before, it actually sounds like a good funny read, if slightly sad that the person who wrote it actually believed what they were writing.
Well I guess then Disney's Adventures of the Gummi Bears must have been one of those influences, watched that every Saturday morning, think it would hold up in court if I blamed that show for influencing me to partake in a minor a crime? Nah, probably not.
quote:
Originally posted by Nandemonai:
The real issue, of course, is that this man should obviously never have been allowed to leave the psychiatric institution. But fixing this would require actual work, and hard work, to get all the various interest groups to agree on a solution. Much easier to blame the convenient scapegoat.
Of course this is probably the answer any time they blame anime or manga or whatever they blame, since it is a lot easier to blame a thing then it is to look at the system and see where they screwed up, such as letting "Norman Bates" out of the psychiatric ward.
It's also easier to blame that "thing" then it is to fix any flaws they might find in the system, not to mention blaming something outside of their control means it's not their fault and they can get re-elected for doing a good thing of moving against something that had nothing to do with the crime. Of course that means they are not fixing something that should be fixed but hey if it happens again it might be on someone else's watch and it's not their fault. Okay that is cynical but is it entirely wrong?
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 08-11-2004).]
It’s more then speculation, I think at one time someone had pictures, maybe this was for the Playstation and maybe only for Japan, but they had pictures showing the differences in how the characters appeared and they were massively noticable differences. I think Yumi looked more like Kana in the other version stole her eye color or something.
As I remember this also resparked the debate about the sex in Kana and how some of us, myself included, thought to remove it might be a crime because in many ways it helps to add to the tragic nature of the game. Also by removing it they are not getting the real thing, and how it will turn out will be very different, might not have the same impact.
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 08-11-2004).]
Here’s the Kana Xbox/PC picture comparison. It’s on the Kana’s Left Kidney fan site.
Not all the information posted on wordiq may be accurate, though. Here’s how their review for Casual Romance Club begins
quote:Thanks for publishing this game, Peach Princess! I really like it, but I never knew you were the publisher. (J-list and perhaps other branches of the Payne empire are resellers of CRC, but I think they’d admit that Libido is the publisher.)
Casual Romance Club is a bishoujo game developed by Libido and QT-Software and published by Peach Princess in October 2003.
It’s a good site, but I find them to be a bit too assuming and entirely correct when describing the genre.
They say that these games are extremely linear. Uh, what? One of the main reasons that I like this genre is because IT ISN’T linear.
They say that the girls are often perfect, but I don’t believe that is true. I’ve found the girls to have a good characterization, with good and bad sides.
They also fail to mention that there are companies translating the game. The translation itself is also not the hard part of localizing the games, as said in an interview with the cough previous board admin cough that I read.
XBox port of Kana? Why would they do that? It’s incredibly unpopular in Japan.
quote:
Originally posted by Benoit:
They say that these games are extremely linear. Uh, what? One of the main reasons that I like this genre is because IT ISN'T linear.
Some bgames yes, others no. Maybe that guys need to play more bishoujo games. (^^)
quote:
They say that the girls are often perfect, but I don't believe that is true. I've found the girls to have a good characterization, with good and bad sides.
I believe they are refering to girl's appearance in general, not personality. They mean almost all the b-game's girls are beautiful and cute.
quote:
They also fail to mention that there are companies translating the game. The translation itself is also not the hard part of localizing the games, as said in an interview with the *cough* previous board admin *cough* that I read.
Check the description for H_Game. There they have some links. But you are right, they need to put some more info about translator companies.
quote:
XBox port of Kana? Why would they do that? It's incredibly unpopular in Japan.
Who knows? Maybe is not so unpopular than you think.
For instance, here, in this japanese poll "The best bishoujo game you played", KANA has the first place (with KIMIGA NOZOMU EIEN in second, and TO HEART in third):
http://iweb.sakuranet.or.jp/~haruno-c/gameplaza/enq_gamerank/msgenq.cgi
(And if KANA is not so famous, at least has a great story ^^)
Uh…you guys do realize that the use of the term Otaku is very different in Japan right?
I doubt too many people here would count as Otakus in Japan…it’s a term for the super geeks who have no lives outside their hobbies, not for people who enjoy Anime/Manga/etc.
I can’t think of too many modern societies that will deem that as good behavior…
quote:
Originally posted by Peter Gilis:
(And if KANA is not so famous, at least has a great story ^^)
I really think htis is what makes Kana stand out. It has that great story so even if people have not played it I bet they have heard of it, much like the movies Wizard of Oz or Gone With the Wind. People may not have seen them but they have heard about them and often more good then bad, at least that is what I think is helping Kana.
quote:
Originally posted by Ex-S Woo:
Uh...you guys do realize that the use of the term Otaku is very different in Japan right?
Yeah, in the same way you can not fly to Japan and yells in a PC Games Convention "I am a HENTAI gamer" without some VERY BAD implications. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/rolleyes.gif[/img]
Yet worse, yell in a Bishoujo Games Convention "Hello, all you HENTAI gamers!" [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/rolleyes.gif[/img]
[This message has been edited by Peter Gilis (edited 08-12-2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by Peter Gilis:
Yeah, in the same way you can not fly to Japan and yells in a PC Games Convention "I am a HENTAI gamer" without some VERY BAD implications. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/rolleyes.gif[/img]
I don't know, if you have your escape route well planned might be kind of fun to try once. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/wink.gif[/img]
Well at least it makes people here that proudly and seriously proclaim such things a little more comical perhaps when you consider the 'homeland' of these games and how such a statement would get them run out of town on a rail most likely.
[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 08-12-2004).]
Yeah otaku has a much more negative connotation in japan. Here it’s more of a positive connotaion of someone who’s an avid fan of anime/manga. Course you can go too far being an avid fan as Many-Faye has shown
I like to move it, move it. I like to move it, move it. I I like to, move it.
Ever since I visited the Man-Faye shrine, I can’t get that stupid song out of my head whenever someone mentions her. Him. It. Cousin It.
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精神 の 神