Well, for the kyonyuu fans, maybe Shingo could talk to boin_master about Kyonyuu Fantasy. That way boin fans will get their boin and everyone else will get a high quality eroge with exceptional writing. Win-win, right?
I remember that someone asked Peter Payne about it at the Otacon or A-X (don’t remember which one) of this year… And Peter Payne said that the excuse of not finding the uncensored data became a little old and that was only a way to tell him that they didn’t want to see Cleavage translated anymore.
That would have been me, and while he hadn’t given up hope completely, he seemed to have resigned himself to the fact that the company had lost interest in getting it translated. In this case, “looking for the images” may very well equate to “we changed our minds, now stop bugging us”.
There is that too. Of course, if Sei Shoujo doesn’t want to bother with it anymore, then there’s no chance of the game ever coming out here. I think basically one of two things has happened, by this point:
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Sei Shoujo would have liked to translate the game, but they can’t find the images, and they don’t want to spend any more time looking; or
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Sei Shoujo decided “eh, this whole translating thing is a lot more work than we thought it would be. Let’s just tell him we can’t find the image data.”
If they really wanted a game translated, I’d think they’d go to Peter and say “Look, Cleavage isn’t going to work out. We have other games … How about translating this game instead?” So I think the fact they haven’t done that, and it’s now more than 2 years later, means it’s probably the latter rather than the former.
I never understood that myself. If they can get the original artist to censor the art like in KK, why can’t they just get the original artist to simply draw an uncensored image over the mosaics?
In my opinion, the entire idea of rejecting a game just because the original company doesn’t have uncensored CG data is ridiculous, given the circumstances in which the games themselves are released here. I mean, most games released by JAST have already been out in Japan for three to four years before they’re licensed, and the western market is way too small for any particular game to have a decent chance of having a release outside of Japan. Why would the R2 companies waste time and resources keeping track of uncensored images that can’t be used in their home turf if they belong to old games that have next to no chance of getting released outside of Japan?
But yeah, the whole “we lost the images” thing equating to JAST or the Japanese companies losing interest in a translated game seems to make more sense though.
Pretty much. It’s just another Slave Bazaar (one of the very notorious examples that a lot of us were interested in) or News Caster Mariko, or La Voyeur. It just hasn’t happened in a few years, that a game would be announced and then later cancelled. (There was also that tactical RPG that Hobibox Europe was working on before they imploded that PP tried to save, but ultimately couldn’t.)
As for what those titles are, a lot of the regulars now weren’t around 6, 7 years ago when these titles were floating around … The BBS search will get some really old posts talking about them. Slave Bazaar was the only one that really had a lot of buzz around it. These were announced very early in PP’s lifespan, then there was no news at all for years, and then the titles were quietly canned.
I wouldn’t expect Peter to make an official announcement that Cleavage has been cancelled until he’s convinced there’s no chance whatsoever it might be resurrected, but it fits the pattern of their past cancellations.
It’s a pity; Dorei Shijou would have been an excellent acquisition. It’s not really about a ‘slave bazaar’ though www
Backup the original Data for the purpose of making :
- A DvDPG edition : since the resolution is note the same, using the original data is far better than using the censored one
- An edition with higher resolution.
- An edition with a thiner mosaic : the censoring law in Japan have changed a lot in those past 10 years.
They’re a ton of reason for keeping the original data.
Yeah, but isn’t having pornographic images with uncensored genitalia in Japan illegal to begin with? Wouldn’t you think the some companies would have their artists make the mosaics a part of original CG images, instead of just layering them over the originals?
That would certainly apply to older games, but what about newer ones where the mosaics are already thinner? Is there really any reason for them to believe that they’ll lax the censorship laws any further?
Either way though, it still doesn’t make any sense for JAST to simply reject a game outright just based on the fact that an eroge company doesn’t have uncensored originals when they could just get the artists to draw over the mosaics themselves. I mean, they already work with the original artists to touch up on portions of original images that are supposed to have mosaics over them (a lot of them are often lacking in detail), so why not get them to draw over the mosaics altogether if it isn’t possible to obtain unmosaiced CGs?
It really would be nice to see why these titles were canned though. Was it because the original companies went under or something?
Not exactly. Distribution is illegal. You can have them in your archives, but you can’t distribute them to the public.
Perhaps. If you were back in time ten years, you might ask the same question. The standards have definitely changed, in favor of a lot less censorship. As time goes on, this sort of censorship has been relaxed in much of the world. Who’s to say that in another ten or fifteen years, the law won’t just be tossed out? I mean, pornography used to be more-or-less illegal in many places in the seventies; the scares about video nasties in Britain, similar hogwash in the US … sure, it isn’t gone yet. But it’s fading.
I see no reason to assume the future won’t change, when it’s never stopped changing in the past.
That is a good question. I’m not sure why that isn’t possible, I just know that nobody does it. G-collections (back when it was a seperate company, and not a brand) and Mangagamer have both released some games that are still partially-censored, and they’re seperate from the Peter Payne empire.
The only one I know why it was canned is Slave Bazaar. Slave Bazaar had two issues: one was a lot of CG involving hand-drawn diary pages, all in Japanese, which would have required some very extensive reworking to be done into English. Another was that Slave Bazaar was not actually developed by Will (I think it was Will and not Crowd); it was only published by them. So to get it translated, not just the publisher, but the original developer, would have needed to be willing to work with Peach Princess. This wasn’t realized until after PP had picked and announced the title; and it wasn’t until a few years later that we found out basically, they either weren’t around anymore or weren’t interested. And that was that.
The others … there’s a reference in a post by Peter somewhere in the archives to Newscaster Mariko being “not a great loss”. That’s all I really know.
I believe Daiginjou were the creators of it; same with Salem no Majo-tachi.
Er, can you give me an example of how the censorship law has been relaxed allowing for ‘thinner’ mosaics? Because I have not observed this; CGs from 1996 have mosaics just as small or smaller than they do now, or are you referring to stuff even earlier?
That’s really easy :
- Look how the mosaic became thiner and thiner in the Pink pineapple’s title.You’ll see a real difference between the Anime produced in 2000 and the last 2/3 years production.
- In the doujin world they’re a lot of very thin Mosaic
- They’re some Av Title specialized in ultra thin mosaic (and this is their selling point)
Now the fact.
i’ll use two Will game
One from Guilty from 2000 (Dennou M Dorei - Reimi) And one from Empress from 2010 (Starless)
[attachment=1]Reimi.jpg[/attachment] [attachment=0]Starless.jpg[/attachment]
i think the difference is pretty obvious ^^
[edit]
Also, the type of mosaic is different for each producer/dev/Editor.
Some will use heavy mosaic, to be sure.Other will use ultra thin one and barelly legal, taking the risk to get refused by the CERO.
Hmm… I don’t know. You might have to provide more image examples for my… research before I’m… convinced…
<.<
I won’t waste time.
Whatever effort i’ll do you’ll never convinced so… I won’t waste time.
I think you missed my sarcastic request for more porn.
Actually, after looking at several years of examples from the same companies over a large duration I’m not seeing any sort of overall trend of mosaic size shrinking. In some cases it’s grown larger (partly to compensate for increased resolution). In any case, what mirage said was that the LAW had been relaxed. If anything it’s been more clarified, since you pretty much only see mosaicing nowadays - a number of the older styles of obscuring have all but disappeared- elf-style ‘just don’t draw anything’, otherwise-style ‘manipulate the angle and lighting’… the main example that’s still present is What-a-Beautiful-style ‘draw everything in such an abstract way people don’t even miss it’. Or perhaps this is just an evolution in style.
are there any programs to undo the mosaic-ing process
AS A MATTER OF FACT there’s one exactly designed for that on dlsite. but of course it basically just blurs the stuff, since you can’t recreate something that doesn’t exist. I don’t see the point, personally.
Plus, from the uncensored ones I’ve seen (where the mosaics were accidentally omitted etc. from the final product, usually resulting in a recall) they don’t exactly put enough effort into the stuff they’re about to put a mosaic over for it to be worth seeing. The mosaics are better. Black Cyc et. al also like to use mosaics for gore since it’s hard to draw stuff like that convincingly- putting the mosaic over it manages to make it look much better with little extra effort.
i know fate stay night is uncensored or at leadt has uncensored cg’s around the interweb
So does Family Project (the forbidden scenes)–fans do the uncensoring, most likely by redrawing the CGs themselves.