H-Game Pet Peeves and Pleasures

Visual Novel Community Archive, 2000-2009
#1

The poll question brought this to mind:

What are your likes and dislikes of H-Games? Your Pet Peeves? Your Personal Pleasures?

Peeves:

Mr. Perfect. I hate the H-Games where the hero is this utterly perfect person: A great fighter, a legendary bad-ass, etc.

“Jewel Knight Crusaders” is one example of this, but that H-Game, despite other problems, at least had the grace to have a self-deprecating sense of humor about it; most H-games that go this route have the hero be too damn perfect.

Irrigation Project # 1.

It seems that some of these H-Game gals, produce enough personal lubrication to irrigate the Sahara. Some graphics artists really need to visit a Soapland and do some informative research. Sheesh!

Blood, or Turn-ons for Vampires, or Irrigation Project # 2:

The same goes for the excessive amounts of blood which can be portrayed in defloration scenes. That’s bad enough, but then you have the ex-virgins continuing to have bleeding every time they engage in sexual activity. One weird fetish.

Deja Vue all over again:

It’s bad enough encountering the same scene and language as you back-track your way looking for the right route in a game, but what’s really bad is when you have the same language and scenes repeated when the events are supposed to happening on different days, different times, etc.

Have you heard of carry-on luggage?

The insertion of items of absurd sive and quantity into various orifices. It’s one thing to have the gal have an egg shaped vibrator taped inside of her, or a butterfly vib for clitoral stimulation; it’s a totally different thing when you have a woman who has two vibrators up her ass, and she still has luggage in the other nether compartment.

Loli. Don’t like it. Not at all.

Rape. Rape is rape. Despite what I just said, there are different types of rape portrayed in H-Games. Some lead to the empowerment and/or sexual liberation of the female character, while other types lead to her degradation and/or enslavement.

Why toilets were invented:

Some sex fetishes and practices escape me. As a guy, I relate well to lesbians: They like women, I like women. I can relate.

But the Japanese obsession with bodily funtions that should be best performed in the toilet totally escapes me. Message skip is a very nice feature.

Is it human or an alien:

Unrealistic genitals. There’s two areas for this peeve: 1) not enough detail; or 2) exagerated detail.

Likes:

Realistic characters and situations.

Good stories.

Solid reasons for the guy to have so many gals after him.

Some of the best H-Games for my taste have been ones where there is a limited choice of girls, because it allows for a concentration on those characters.

Hey, the more the merrier, but at least make sure that there’s good motivations at work.

I’ve more likes and dislikes, but what are yours?

#2

Why would anyone shove 2 vibrators into a confined space within 4 centimeters? you’d think they’re getting too cheap to buy the “Ultra” model that comes with 4x the power…

#3

Definitely have to second all your “like” entries.

"…but what’s really bad is when you have the same language and scenes repeated when the events are supposed to happening on different days…"

Maybe it’s just my Inner Spellcheck talking, but one of the many problems in Nocturnal Illusion was inconsistent room description. No two lines of code were the same.

On the perfect hero: I liked the main character in Critical Point. Actually displays leadership qualities, never whines.

#4

Perfect heroes? I haven’t seen a one. Every h-game lead I’ve ever played has either been a bit of a loser (not in a bad way necessarily, but enough that other characters will make fun of him) or a JERK.

The Critical Point hero, for me, counts as an asshole - in personal matters. It made sense for him to be a bit that way because of his background and profession, and the leadership qualities you refer to were useful in the situation, but I did not care for the way he treated the female characters at many points. That’s the main reason I sold that game on after completing it. I have no urge to replay a jerk.

(Since I did resell it years back, I can’t pull it up and show the exact scenes that bothered me, and my memory may be a bit hazy.)

#5
quote:
Originally posted by papillon:
*Perfect* heroes? I haven't seen a one. Every h-game lead I've ever played has either been a bit of a loser (not in a bad way necessarily, but enough that other characters will make fun of him) or a JERK.

You can't have played enough Japanese ero-games then. Plenty of "perfect" (or close to) protagonists there. Not that there aren't a lot of jerks as well, but...

As for personal pet peeves...

Too much sex: Constant sex which overshadows any other aspect of gameplay/story.

Rape/molestation/harassment/abuse: Not my cup of tea. If the game gives you a choice between being nice or not, it becomes a different matter as I'm not forced to assault women.

S&M: Really not my cup of tea, consensual or not. I draw the line at bondage, which is ok (but not really a favorite).

*Edit*
Oops, botched quote.

[This message has been edited by AG3 (edited 01-14-2005).]

#6
quote:
Originally posted by general_hentai:
It seems that some of these H-Game gals, produce enough personal lubrication to irrigate the Sahara.
[/B]

Ha! Can't stand that myself, particularly the frankly gross, um, "splash" effect used in Trabulance games. I mean, what?

There are a few others, most notably dull heroes completely devoid of personality or backbone. Excessive dialogue during sex is another one. Why do the female characters feel the need to give a constant descriptive running commentary? And phrases like "it feels like you're ripping me apart" or any (I meanany, dammit) reference to wombs. I DON'T WANT TO KNOW WHERE IT'S "HITTING", OKAY?

Phew, glad I got that off my chest.

#7

I like:

-Good stories.
-Cute girls that really love you and show it, like Arisa in True Love.

I dislike:

-Too many sex scenes.
-The “child-hood friend” cliche. I’m really tired of this. There’s always at least one girl that is, and she almost always already loves you, and is easy to impress.
-Rape.
-Bad main characters. Like jerks, real losers, etc.

#8
quote:
Originally posted by general_hentai:
What are your likes and dislikes of H-Games? Your Pet Peeves? Your Personal Pleasures?
One thing I try to keep in mind is that b-games are designed primarily for a Japanese audience. Our likes or dislikes are not entirely relevant. That being said, my preferences are similar to yours.

quote:
Peeves:

Mr. Perfect. I hate the H-Games where the hero is this utterly perfect person: A great fighter, a legendary bad-ass, etc.

Yeah, he's the type we geeks thought of as the overbearing jock back in school. Totally self-centered, bullying, insensitive, able to attract any female on campus for a one night stand. It must be a biological attraction for the alpha male.

On the other hand, there's the typical indecisive, clueless wimp. He could win the ideal girl who's just waiting for him to make the right gesture or say the right word. Unfortunately, it takes him 9/10 of the story to come to that realization. In the meantime we have to watch him play into misunderstandings and say just the wrong thing to alienate his eventual match.

quote:
Irrigation Project # 1.
I don't know if you're aware, but there is something called the G-spot orgasm that results in the release of copious fluids [not bladder related]. I've observed such and know it's not necessarily far from reality.

quote:
Blood, or Turn-ons for Vampires, or Irrigation Project # 2:
Yeah, blood is one of those Japanese things that doesn't do much for me either. I understand it to mean loss of innocence or the sacrifice of love, but I'd just as soon pass on the symbolism.

quote:
Deja Vue all over again:
Sign of a poorly written or hastily assembled story. When I play games without a lot of repetition, I appreciate the extra effort that went into them.

quote:
Have you heard of carry-on luggage?
I've always regarded toys as being over-rated. They're a poor substitute for fingers, although there's something to be said for vibrators.

quote:
Loli. Don't like it. Not at all.
Here I'm pretty much neutral. To be honest, I don't view any inanimate 2D representation as pornographic. To me they're just bishoujo, not something to get off on. I have to say I do find images that are portrayed as mature and fully developed more appealing.

quote:
Rape. Rape is rape.
Have to agree. I can't imagine taking pleasure in any such encounter in either real life or fantasy. It makes me wonder about the dark undercurrents of the psyches of Japanese men and some of my gaijin compatriots. My fantasy would be to see such characters receive immediate retribution and justice before they have a chance to harm others. I don't advocate censorship or suppression. I just avoid all kichiku games like the plague.

quote:
Why toilets were invented:
Don't understand this fetish either. All I can think of are bacteria, nasty smells, and a cleanup problem when I see such scenes.

quote:
As a guy, I relate well to lesbians: They like women, I like women. I can relate.
Agree. Yuri is OK by me. Yaoi just seems strange.

quote:
Is it human or an alien:
I'm still trying to figure out the catgirl thing. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img] Thankfully, there haven't been too many English b-games featuring tentacles.

quote:
Unrealistic genitals. There's two areas for this peeve: 1) not enough detail; or 2) exagerated detail.
I'd rather have tasteful artwork that depicts realistic scenes. I find mosaics, phantom organs and whiteouts distracting. I'd rather they use strategic angles or clothing to mask illegal body parts.

quote:
Likes:

Realistic characters and situations.

I think there's a consensus here that story-driven games are the best. Sex should be used to further relationships rather than provide "hands-free" moments.

I appreciate realist dialogue during h-scenes. "Please don't look" doesn't correspond to real life in my experience. I think this sort of feigned embarrassment is a cultural norm and has to be understood in that light. I do prefer the shy, demure type who's more concerned with her partner's happiness than her own. She doesn't have to be a doormat to put the relationship and family above selfishness and materialism.

#9

I hate the fact that the characters never change their clothes. In some instances, this is okay, for example at private school, where everyone is required to wear a uniform everyday.
But other than that, it’s annoying to see them in one set of civilian clothes over and over again.

It doesn’t seem like it would be that hard to add a couple of different outfits in there. All they need to do is paste an already made head on a new body with different clothes.

The rapes and the loli-cons aren’t cute at all. Especially the rapes where everyone just grabs everyone else and forces them while saying things like "See your (insert body part) is being honest, look at how wet you are."

Then the person being raped starts moaning about how good it feels and how they’re just about ready to climax, and after it’s over the rapist calls them a “slut, whore other adjectives.”

Of course by that point they have a new sex slave.

#10

Likes:

-Cute Girls. (Of course)

-Good stories.

-Convincing characterization. (Esp. that the motives for the actions of the characters can be understood and are convincing)

-Nice artwork.

-Catgirls. Catgirls and Maids, to be more precise.

Dislikes:

-Abuse. While I can stomach an occasional rape scene or two, I don’t like games which center on the idea of systematic abuse of the girls. And I don’t care if there is a reason trying to justify such abuse (like revenge, for example). I simply prefer games where the main character is motivated by love towards the girls.

-Lolis.

-S&M.

-Too big breasts. Mind you, I like breasts, but in some games the size is just too much.

-When the main focus of the game is the sex. The sex is fine, but the main focus of a game should be elsewhere, like on the characters or on some story.

-“Along-the-way-sex”, i.e. when there isn’t a good enough motivation for having sex.

-Artwork Style. The artwork is very important for me and if I don’t like the style of the art in a game, it is a major turn-off for me. Such a game has to be really, really good for me to like it. On the other hand, if a game has artwork that I like a lot, it can be reason enough to buy that game.

-Stupid Protagonists.

EDIT: I should add guro to my hate-list. Although we haven’t seen much of this in translated games and hopefully won’t see much in the future, it’s something that sickens me to no end.

[This message has been edited by Akela (edited 01-15-2005).]

[This message has been edited by Akela (edited 01-17-2005).]

#11
quote:

It doesn't seem like it would be that hard to add a couple of different outfits in there. All they need to do is paste an already made head on a new body with different clothes.

It's no trouble, until *you* have to draw it.

Take, for example, the current project I'm doing. It takes place over the course of a week. Now, if I leave everyone in the same clothes all the time, the player understands that, silly as it is, this is just a standard thing and doesn't mean anything. But if the girl wears the same clothes for two days, then a different set for two days, then back to the first set for two days, people will start wondering what's going on. What was special about those two days where she wore something different? What did it mean? Why was she wearing her clothes for two days at a time?

So, to be 'realistic', I'd need a different set of clothes for EACH day.

As for just pasting a head on a body, well, some expression changes change the body posture, too. So each outfit would have to be done a few times.

7 days, multiple poses, 5 major girls, more clothes if you want the minor characters to change as well.... suddenly this simple task is piling up into an awful lot of extra art and time that could have been spent doing something more interesting. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

Obviously, you have a right to your pet peeve. And when it's feasible, having some different outfits is a nice idea. But it's not *quite* as simple as you make it seem, sometimes. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

#12
quote:
Originally posted by papillon:
Take, for example, the current project I'm doing. It takes place over the course of a week. Now, if I leave everyone in the same clothes all the time, the player understands that, silly as it is, this is just a standard thing and doesn't mean anything. But if the girl wears the same clothes for two days, then a different set for two days, then back to the first set for two days, people will start wondering what's going on. What was special about those two days where she wore something different? What did it mean? Why was she wearing her clothes for two days at a time?

So, to be 'realistic', I'd need a different set of clothes for EACH day.

Not necessarily. It'd be marginally more work than making 2 costumes to have someone randomly decide what to wear. (E.g. when day 3 begins, randomly pick which set of character art you'll display that day.) Then, you be sure to explain this in the help file.

Of course, this would require actual work, so I can completely understand why you wouldn't want to do that. :)

#13

shrug I’d personally find it more distracting if characters were alternating between two outfits for no apparent reason.

I think HdR had three outfits, didn’t it? One for normal school, one for ‘outings’, and one nightclothes? And used whichever one was most appropriate for the situation.

I could potentially make nightclothes-versions for each of the five major girls, especially since they’ve already been designed for a static image somewhere. Would that appease the desire for more clothes?

(Hrm, and then if you’re using the Secret Adult Cheat Code, the nightclothes could become translucent… This might work out!)

#14
quote:
Originally posted by papillon:
(Hrm, and then if you're using the Secret Adult Cheat Code, the nightclothes could become translucent.... This might work out!)

ok, gimme 10 copies of that cheat code... [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

#15
quote:
Originally posted by perigee:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by general_hentai:
[b]What are your likes and dislikes of H-Games? Your Pet Peeves? Your Personal Pleasures?
quote:
One thing I try to keep in mind is that b-games are designed primarily for a Japanese audience. Our likes or dislikes are not entirely relevant. That being said, my preferences are similar to yours.

Oh, I very much keep that in mind. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

I'm struck by the similarity between modern Japanese sexual morays and those of Victorian England.

It's very common in Victorian erotica for a woman to be raped, which then releases her sex drive, causing her to be an eager and willing participant in further sex play (that's not always the case in Victorian erotica, of course, as with Japanese ero, there are always different strokes for different folks). We see this type of rape often in Japanese ero.

There was the darker form of Victorian ero, where the raped woman's will was broken, and she became subservient. From my perspective, this was not in the majority of Victorian era erotica, but that's personal, not scientific, evaluation.

In Japanese ero, anime, manga and H-Games, however, this type of rape seems to be very common, so much so that my impression is that it out-numbers the "positive sexual awakening" (my apologies ladies, for using that phrase to describe the act of rape, but I can't come up with a more accurate description at the moment).

It seems very common to see a gal whose will has been crushed and turned into a sex toy, who only lives for sex.

I think the reason for this reversal in rape outcomes between modern Japan and Victorian times is due to there having been no acceptable sexual outlet for "proper" women, outside of marriage, which is different than Japan of today.

Even so, the other similarity is that women in Japan still seem to be divided into "wives and sluts"; again we have the similarity between the wide availability of prostitutes in Victorian times, and the well-known presence in Japan of a thriving sex-trade.

quote:
Irrigation Project # 1.
quote:
I don't know if you're aware, but there is something called the G-spot orgasm that results in the release of copious fluids [not bladder related]. I've observed such and know it's not necessarily far from reality.

Oh, I'm also personally familiar with female ejaculation. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/wink.gif[/img] [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

But, while such exists, it isn't the norm. Of the 50+ women I've made love to over the last 25 years, I've only run into it once. And the girl who had that experience told me that the only women she knew who had similiar experiences were her mother and sister.

But when you have every gal doing it...eh.

quote:
Rape. Rape is rape.
quote:
Have to agree. I can't imagine taking pleasure in any such encounter in either real life or fantasy. It makes me wonder about the dark undercurrents of the psyches of Japanese men and some of my gaijin compatriots. My fantasy would be to see such characters receive immediate retribution and justice before they have a chance to harm others. I don't advocate censorship or suppression. I just avoid all kichiku games like the plague.

Yeah, it's definitely cultural, as I noted above. Mot only that, but you can see it in a lot of anime, where it's almost assumed that if a guy and gal are alone together, he's going to "have his way with her"...not only that, but that the woman wouldn't be alone with him if she didn't want him to to do so.

It's the old "no means yes" line, which we seem to be growing away from here in the West.

quote:
Likes:

Realistic characters and situations.

quote:
I think there's a consensus here that story-driven games are the best. Sex should be used to further relationships rather than provide "hands-free" moments.

I appreciate realist dialogue during h-scenes. "Please don't look" doesn't correspond to real life in my experience. I think this sort of feigned embarrassment is a cultural norm and has to be understood in that light. I do prefer the shy, demure type who's more concerned with her partner's happiness than her own. She doesn't have to be a doormat to put the relationship and family above selfishness and materialism.[/b]

Well, I find that the embarassament scene is almost standard in any hentai media.

As to the verbalization: That's something that I don't mind, as I look at it as being necessary for this type of hentai.

I mean, the idea is to get the customer off, not the character. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

I find there's less of this in anime H, as there's not as much need for it, although ther's certainly some of that.

As to the "womb" comments, I think that's two-fold: First, there's the obvious flattering reference to the character (and therefore the customer's) size. The second aspect is my own personal theory: Family life is very important in Japan, so I think this is an unconscious cultural matter, where in essence, the character (& customer) is being told that he's got what it takes to father children.

[This message has been edited by general_hentai (edited 01-15-2005).]

[This message has been edited by general_hentai (edited 01-15-2005).]

#16

Your number 1 True Love girl is Mayumi.
Your number 2 is Chiemi.

Yeah, I liked Mayumi a lot, too.

Hehe, I have a great memory.

#17

What I like in my H-games:

1. Romantic Love

2. Very “anime-ish” looking characters (I find the more realistic-looking designs to be somewhat lacking aesthetically). I really like the designs in Kimi Ga Nozomu Eien (both the game and anime), and Hourglass of Summer, for example.

3. Involving storylines that build romantic tension, and H-scenes that further the story or serve as a romantic climax rather than just being there for the sex.

4. High-fantasy settings. Haven’t seen many of these in the English market.

5. Postive gameplay elements. It’s nice when the game actually engages you somehow, rather than just presenting itself as a visual “choose your own adventure” novel. However, many “gameplay” systems I’ve seen just make the game boring, tedious, and repetitive.

6. Younger characters. I’m attracted by their innocence and cuteness. I like the average character in a game to appear high school age (14-17). The “younger sister” character-type is one of my favorites, including many of the qualities I like all in one neat package. She doesn’t necessarily need to be a “real” younger sister or a stepsister.

Dislikes:

1. Overly difficult or complex games, or games that have choices that seem to have random and unpredictable effects (i.e. Tokimeki Check-in and Snow Drop). I don’t consider Hourglass of Summer to fall into this category.

2. Sex romps that lack substance or proper motivation for the sex.

3. Rape, domination, and suffering. It’s even more of a turn-off when the protagonist is the raper, and mandatory rape scenes are the worst. I don’t care if she “actually liked it.” I don’t.

4. Blood and excretory matter/fluids. Gross…

5. Older women. Not my thing. Overly “experienced” women fall into this category as well.

6. Repetition. I hate repetition. It should be avoided whenever possible, and alternate paths should ideally be designed with this in mind as well.

7. Gameplay elements that detract from the game experience rather than enhance it.

8. Games that rely too heavily on cliche. I’d like to see something fresh, rather than a rehash of something that’s already been done a thousand times before.

[This message has been edited by Dark_Shiki (edited 01-17-2005).]

#18
quote:
Originally posted by papillon:
It's no trouble, until *you* have to draw it.

Take, for example, the current project I'm doing. It takes place over the course of a week. Now, if I leave everyone in the same clothes all the time, the player understands that, silly as it is, this is just a standard thing and doesn't mean anything. But if the girl wears the same clothes for two days, then a different set for two days, then back to the first set for two days, people will start wondering what's going on. What was special about those two days where she wore something different? What did it mean? Why was she wearing her clothes for two days at a time?

So, to be 'realistic', I'd need a different set of clothes for EACH day.

As for just pasting a head on a body, well, some expression changes change the body posture, too. So each outfit would have to be done a few times.

7 days, multiple poses, 5 major girls, more clothes if you want the minor characters to change as well.... suddenly this simple task is piling up into an awful lot of extra art and time that could have been spent doing something more interesting. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

Obviously, you have a right to your pet peeve. And when it's feasible, having some different outfits is a nice idea. But it's not *quite* as simple as you make it seem, sometimes. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

But the artwork would be computerized, right? you're going to have separate files for each person/pose, and then add clothes to it (w/ a separate file for each person/clothes). To me, the hard part is the sex scenes; those are what makes or breaks the game, graphically, for a lot of players.

#19

Well, computerized or not, someone has to draw them in the end.

Besides, I tend to agree with papillon that characters changing clothes for no apparent reason would be irritating. Especially, because in b-games the clothes a character wears often indicate the kind of occasion. So, if the “normal” outfit changes, it’s hard to tell when a character wears something special. This takes away from the atmosphere of “special” occasions.

#20

like:
1. Good in-depth stories.
2. Replayability. This could mean multiple paths, unlocking hidden storylines, or just one hell of a damn good storyline (although if it just strings you along such as games like Chain, it had better be VERY good).
3. Cute Anime-ish girls (i’m not as fond of the more realistic ones generally)
4. H-Game RPGs…something sorely lacking here.
5. H-Game life siluators (like princess maker, true love, and even Mayclub could be to a small extent FE)…something also sorely lacking here
6. Darker occultish anime, like Divi-Dead
7. Games that require me to actually do some thinking…but sadly i may be of the few who actually wants to challenge my brain…
8. Games that have a lot of redrawn character poses and artwork.
9. Games that allow you to view, after completion everything, not just h-scenes, but character poses and other artwork

Dislike

1. Games that give too many sex scenes, give them too early and/or too easily (all of these are usually all combined and when this happens the storyline seems to suffer because its more of how to/how long to get to the next h-scene).
2. Extremely large breasted women, epseically when all of them are that way.
3. Cardboard characters, for anyone but those who are just in for a scene, but espeically for the protagonist, antagonist (if any) and main supporting characters.
4. Games with predictable outcomes from the start.
5. Games that force you to end up with a particular girl.
6. Games that have no real choices, ie Chain, Desire, etc. Soemtimes the storylines can overcome this limitation, but i’ve only played a handful that have.
7. Games that i can finish easily and/or in one (normal) session.