Just finished playing Discipline

Seriously? Neither of you are going to win this argument. I happen to side with papillon on this one, but your arguing isn’t going to get either person to change their mind.

This isn’t a thread about the moral consequences of rape, it’s a thread about Disciple.

Please don’t hijack the thread and turn it into a never ending argument that no one will win. Might I suggest creating a thread to discuss this issue in the off-topic forum, and leave the game discussion for this thread?

Otherwise this thread will be full of nothing but drama.

I didn’t say anything about who would win. I said if a man doesn’t want to be accused of rape, he shouldn’t boink drunk girls.

Well, yes. People are very different. Some behave in weird ways. That’s why you shouldn’t take anything for granted. :slight_smile:

Which argument? This is a pretty long rambling discussion covering a heck of a lot of points, some of which we agree on, some of which we don’t. And I think we’ve both come up with some interesting things we hadn’t known before.

The only thing we’re really arguing about is whether it’s possible for a woman to forcibly rape a man in a PIV context, and yes, it seems unlikely that we’re going to reach agreement on that because he believes there’s an alternate explanation for every recorded incident. :slight_smile:

A discussion shouldn’t be about winning. If that was the case all discussions should be stopped because you usually can’t really change the other person’s mind very much. A discussion should only be about finding out how other people think about the discussed subject. So you should respect other people’s right to have other opinions.

You are right that this discussion has been quite long and also too much sidetracked. The concept of rape is important when a game like Discipline is discussed though. But I don’t really think either that our discussion should continue much further unless it changes to something which is more relevant to the game. I also think that we can’t really do much more to enlighten each other in our general viewpoints about the rape concept.

To help put this to rest completely, after being stationed in South Korea twice I can safely say a woman CAN rape a man. Just ask the Russian drinking girls at the bars outside a military post. Olga want man, Olga GET man. Aside from that Discipline was a pretty bad game in the first place so let’s just let it fade away again.

The problem is that the word “rape” is used differently by different persons. Even the definition of “rape” by different jurisdictions differs:

“Some jurisdictions define “rape” to cover only acts involving penile penetration of the vagina, treating all other types of non-consensual sexual activity as sexual assault. Other jurisdictions define all non-consensual sexual activity to be rape. But the terminology varies, with some places using other terms. For example, Michigan, United States uses the term “criminal sexual conduct”. In some jurisdictions, rape is defined in terms of sexual penetration of the victim, which may include penetration with objects, rather than body parts. Some jurisdictions also consider rape to include the use of sexual organs of one or both of the parties, such as oral copulation and masturbation.” (From Wikipedia)

Unless you narrow the definition to only mean “penile penetration of the vagina” in cases where the man would fight against with all means there is no doubt that men can be raped. So the discussion is a little theoretical because that won’t happen very often.

So the only thing we don’t agree about is cases like a woman trying to infect a man with AIDS by forcing him to intercourse after she has told him that he will die if she succeeds. Even this isn’t very likely anymore because people don’t die from AIDS anymore except in very poor countries.

Even in the last mentioned cases it may be possible if the woman uses high doses of forced viagra or forces the man into unconsciousness by stopping oxygen to his brain. But otherwise I still don’t think that an ordinary woman could do it.

Unless somebody can find evidence that proves my last statement wrong I think that we should stop this discussion because we are now repeating ourselves too much.

I just found an answer in Wikipedia which seems to agree with me:

[i]"In recent years, women have been convicted of raping or sexually assaulting men; for example, by the use of an object or when the man is below the statutory age of consent. Also, in recent years women have also been convicted of rape or sexual assault by procuring a man to rape another woman, and by being an accomplice to a rape.

In the UK, male rape is recognised by the British legal system as a crime. [5][6] In Scotland, rape is a gender-specific crime; it can only be committed by males upon females. Oral, anal and male rape do not legally constitute rape, nor is digital penetration sufficient.[7]

In Brazil, the definition of rape is even more restrictive. It is defined as non-consensual vaginal sex.[8] Therefore, unlike most of Europe and the Americas, male rape, anal rape, and oral rape are not considered to be rape. Instead, such an act is called a “violent attempt against someone’s modesty” (“Atentado violento ao pudor”). The penalty, however, is the same."[/i]

Copied from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_of_males

My comment was made completely in jest. To put it bluntly, there are some BIG, and by big I don’t mean fat, Russian women over there. I knew guys in my unit who would avoid certain bars simply because said women were so physically imposing. Regardless this discussion needs to end as it really doesn’t belong here in the first place.

Then let me try to bring the discussion back to the subject.

I don’t agree. There are much worse games (like X-Change and Amorous Professor Cherry).

Discipline has some very kinky sex scenes where beautiful girls take advantage of a guy’s unreasonable strong potency. Nearly all the sex scenes are much more interesting than the lame and nearly identically sex scenes in other games.

The sex scenes in the two other mentioned games are awful unless you like fantasies about a man in a woman’s body being raped by both guys and women - or about a guy having sex with woman who are twice as old as he is. (I don’t like any of those things.)

So the quality of the sex scenes make Discipline worth buying and so does the unusually high number of beautiful girls. The story is also better than in many other games.

But I agree that Disipline has a serious downside: The endings. The bad endings are awful and I just don’t understand why the Japanese love such bad endings. Even the only good ending is lame and unsatisfying. Such a shame for this game.

The two issues that killed it for me were the endings, just as you mentioned, and the protagonist. I can understand someone having a submissive attitude, it happens, but this was ridiculous. I can’t even imagine ANY human being, male or female ever taking that much punishment without at least simply leaving (a completely viable option for him), going to the police (wouldn’t be hard to prove the unlawful activities there), or lashing out violently. I kept wondering why “Punch Leona in the Face” wasn’t one of the options listed. It simply destroyed any sense of immersion with the game which, to me at least, is pretty important.

The protagonist is very special because of his unreasonably strong potency. He gets total erection just by seeing a girls panties or her breasts in a bra even in situations where he just had sex with a couple of girls two minutes ago. Therefore he isn’t able to resist any of the girls and he wouldn’t even be able to resist if they never used the drug on him.

He is a type who likes to complain because he is extremely lazy (a protagonist theme which you also can find in many other bishoujo games and which the Japanese seems to like). The girls are energetic and the guys are lazy. Therefore the girls are stronger than the guys. A fantasy which is popular in Japan. But not something that I can recognize from the real world.

It is correct that it can be difficult to win over very rich families. Especially if you live in a country with much corruption which is the case in the game. This doesn’t seem to be realistic because the country is Japan and I don’t think that Japan is that corrupt. But stories doesn’t have to be total realistic and the stories in other games are not very realistic either. (Some games even have supernatural themes.) The power of Leona’s family seems to be a little too extreme though. But this is a matter of taste.

The drug which Leona uses of course isn’t realistic either. You just can’t make a drug which is equally efficient on both sexes and which can threaten your life but only if you don’t have sex immediately. This is pure fantasy. But it is an interesting fantasy. What if such a drug existed in the real world? What consequences would this have?

The Japanese use the fantasy about a protagonist which is totally dominated by beautiful girls in other games too. They seem to like that fantasy. What if we were surrounded by beautiful girls who just wanted to seduce us too? The problem would be that we got more sex than we really wanted. But would that really be worse than the opposite life where you just try to seduce girls in vain and never have any luck?

is there any sex change in the game
just wanted to know what it is since it is listed in the tAgs here
http://vndb.org/v114

I an honestly say that this is the only case where I liked the anime better than the game

Too old. Do not want.

I only got it to support them, Kitty that is. I’ll play it sometime, just like everything else, eventually.

kitty didn’t release the anime japanime did

Sorry, I failed to specify that I’m speaking of the game, and it does have the kitty logo on the box. I’m fairly certain they localized the game. I don’t watch hentai anime, so I don’t know anything about that version.

JapanAnime didn’t release it, AMORZ Entertainment did under their 7 Geishas imprint.
http://www.amorz.com/discipline/index.html

I wonder if they’ll ever bring out the Blu-ray version…
http://www.jlist.com/PRODUCT/WBRB001