The demand for Snow Drop

Visual Novel Community Archive, 2000-2009
#1

Well, according to what Kumiko has said, Snow Drop is still just the third most popular of Peach Princess games… but, strangely enough, there seems to be quite large “invisible” demand for Snow Drop. I’ve visited quite many pirate sites, and on these sites or their forums, it’s Snow Drop that people mostly “asks” for, not Tokimeki Check-in, not Water Closet and not X-Change… Stange, don’t you think? Or maybe you’ve the same impression of this as I…

Every time I see a post like that, I tell that person about the adult bishoujo game market, directs him/her to Peach Princess or their distributors and tells him/her that he/she should buy the game, escapilly if he/she wants to see more english bishoujo games at the market. But you have to wonder how many who actually listens to what I say or even believes it (When I tell those people aboutt his, they’'re kind of having a hard time believing me or doesn’t believe me at all).

#2

Maybe it’s because of the piracy that it’s only the third best seller. I’m sure the “invisible” demand has generated a lot of “invisible” sales, if you catch my drift.

#3

disclamer: pirating is bad!!!

Well my first impression would be that
the “other” demand doesn’t have a effect
on true sales of any product. Poeple are going to do some-amount of this no matter what. If I like it I buy it, but the higher the retail the more I want to see a working demo before I shell out bucks for a game…
The odd thing is that it seems like the higher the retail, the less likey these will be a playable demo. Example : Serious sam # 2
will be out on the 5th… Its one of the best
FPS to come-out in a long time! (IMO)…

There demo 90megs and fully playable for one level. Retail cost of this game? $19.95!

Peachy here is mid to high in cost. Having NEVER played one of these type of games, after wandering in looking for something else… they looked very interesting… But it took me 3 weeks to really make-up my mind to place a order. Why? Its very hard to get a feel what these games when there are with no demos.
My machine would not play ANY of the preview
videos at all. They need to be in a format anyone can use, like mpg. With these condishions is hard to be hard on ripped copy
of something. I rarely ever buy a game that dont have some kind of preview or demo. I have after trying a game or app, bought the
package. If I dont like it, I dont use it and delete it. But why should I pay big bucks to try a product that I may really not like, with the rebuttal beinging that if I dont like it I can sell it on ebay? If there playeable demos, I think it would be much easyer to market the full games. Copying anything with intent to never pay is not a option. Try before you buy? You bet.

Your work, My Money… gotta be a middle ground!..

Oopps, boy did this wander around! if you need to move this to a new topic, feel free

Roger Before coffee…

#4

there seems to be quite large “invisible” demand for Snow Drop


Spectator Beholder, I don’t want to fuel unnecessary speculation, but the ‘demand’ for Snow Drop among pirate forums may not necessarily be due to its ‘popularity’, but may be due to the installation nature of Snow Drop. Those who have Snow Drop, Tokimeki Check-In and X-change will know what I mean. Pirates do take the easiest path possible.

[This message has been edited by bokmeow (edited 02-04-2002).]

#5
quote:
Originally posted by The Hedonist:
(...)
My machine would not play ANY of the preview
videos at all. They need to be in a format anyone can use, like mpg.

".wmv" is a standard video format for Windows ("wmv" = "Windows Media Video" IIRC)... Just use your Windows Media Player...
Except if you're on Mac or Unix... But then the game wouldn't work anyway... ^^;;;;;

#6

I agree with you Hedonist completely.
Try before you buy is the best way to know if it’s really worth getting a game or not.
I do it with most Pc games today,I download the full game try it out for 1-2 hours or so and if I think the games is not worth any money I’ll delete it and throw it away.
If it’s good I’ll just buy the retail version =)
Just playing demo’s are a bit so and so,first of all you can’t trust demos because they usually just try to show the best part of the game and then the rest can just be pure crap =P

Spectator:Nah i’m not quite sure about any huge demand for Snow Drop really,atleast in the circles I move around in the people there usually likes to get the newest games from japan instead

#7
quote:
Originally posted by olf_le_fol:
".wmv" is a standard video format for Windows ("wmv" = "Windows Media Video" IIRC)... Just use your Windows Media Player...
Except if you're on Mac or Unix... But then the game wouldn't work anyway... ^^;;;;;

Don't work on my machine.. WMV maybe a microsohaft standard, but it isint the only one by far. In "real life" I'm a field service Tech. I know how to run basic and complex apps and the videos dont work. could be becaues I haven't and wont install ANY flavor of Internet Exploder... I use netscape 4.x and Pegasus for my mail. Just say no outlook.

Markets have to go both ways, you just cant say come buy this its great without some way
for poeple to try it first. Yes you must have demand to make more better, games but how do you create demand with no demos in a market that hasen't seen any thing like this genre?
And just to be clear, no I'm NOT learning japanise just to play a game..

#8

Well, about demos, I believe that Kumiko has explained why there isn’t any playable demos for their games; they’d mostly be too huge because of various reasons, sich as the facial animatins/expressions in the game (remember, the LMM japanese demo and the Newscaster Mariko demos were quite huge with kust a few of those things… then imagine how huge a playable demo could be then ^^;; ). And it’s not cheap to offer them for downloading either. And these games does certainly have demos and previews, even if they’re not exactly offered everywhere.

[This message has been edited by Spectator Beholder (edited 02-04-2002).]

#9
quote:

Markets have to go both ways, you just cant say come buy this its great without some way
for poeple to try it first. Yes you must have demand to make more better, games but how do you create demand with no demos in a market that hasen't seen any thing like this genre?
And just to be clear, no I'm NOT learning japanise just to play a game..

You are right about that people don't know about the games, so there will be even less of a demand if they don't know about the genre. But, I think one of the more insurmountable obstacle is the perception that Bishoujo games invariably have erotic content, or that erotic content is the sole focus of these games, even if they contain none whatsoever. Even something as innocuous as Princess Maker 2 got blown to bits because of overreaction. Many 'self-proclaimed fan' pirates do much to hurt the genre by maintaining the dominant belief that the sole reason for playing Bishoujo games is for the erotic CG's, as well as balking at the length of dialogue and story they have to skip through in order to get to them, thereby only serving to fuel the harsh critics of the genre.

No shame in learning Japanese while playing a game though, Hedonist, or even learning Japanese so you can watch Anime and Japanese dramas. It shows an inclination toward learning world culture. Keeping an open-mind is a priceless merit.

#10

No shame in learning Japanese while playing a game though, Hedonist, or even learning Japanese so you can watch Anime and Japanese dramas. It shows an inclination toward learning world culture. Keeping an open-mind is a priceless merit.[/B][/QUOTE]

Truely spoken, I was more referring to personal
time limits, then culture bias. since I am that that stage in career where I am at the top of the curve, it gets more diffacult to find time just to "play" . lack of time more then anything else. Pardon If I gave any other impression.

I must take issue th'o with your take on the sexual content of these games.. (without seeing it yet), like most stories written or taped, it is the writers vision which moves the storie. Sex in a storie like these may just seem to make the game more true to life, as I seem to member we do have it! [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/wink.gif[/img]

I think that games like these would look too much like a soap-opera without that added spice...Or look like a sit-com. Ech!!

I guess to narrow it down, I really dont care for stright "life" type sims because I like my gaming to take me where I can't go in real life. Getting turned down by a prettie girl just don't seem to me a "gaming fun thing" to me, if I want that, I can do that anyday!

#11

please don’t take this as personal, but this is how you "sound to me"

Wow…

I guess then you miss the point of the law-suits against MS
No choice is just that, use ours or nothing. When I can go to comp-usa
and get some-other OS for my pc right of the shelf, then I will agree
that MS is being a good corp citizin. Corps board/pres should be directly
responicable for what they do.

Every WMV that I have recompressed with Dirv-4 is smaller, higher bit
rate.

Our sales model goes like this:

I want to sell to russia

We will need to modify our product to
match cust expections

We will then be able to sell in same market.

Here is real-world type example for you

I send my co-working to repair a DOA system.

The cust wants system repaired so he can us it.

worker says I can fix it but you must use my stuff,
not yours and do things the way I say.

Cust (who is paying) says No, I will get someone who
wants to service me in the way I want not the way you want.
End of sale and cust will not be calling back
Needless to say this person dont work for me anymore.

you want turn that upside down.

Quote:

important for you all to
show them that you want their products. All of their products, when they are offered… they are not convinced
because of past behavior of the English market

Quote off

Are you kidding?? Not a chance, offer Me a product I want and I will
buy and maybe come back again. Don’t offer what I want, how I want???
ok, I’ll buy it from from someone who will. Someone will want to make the money
that you are passing up. As a consumer, It isint MY job to modify what I want to
meet your offing, ITS your job to meet the custumors expections!.
If this is the prevailing aditude on the main-land I can see why the
previous attemps have not worked.

Gosh, maybe I’m just not understanding what you are trying to
convey, But the culture aspect of this is unimportant.

Comes down to a simple idea, Sell the custumor what they want
Buy stuff to support a genre? NOPE! You offer, I buy If available
You no gots?? Ok someone else will. Genre going out of bizz?
Too bad so sad, maybe next try at us you get it right.

Someone who wants the profit, will match the consumers demands.


sorry if this sounds like Bad mojo.


[This message has been edited by The Hedonist (edited 02-05-2002).]

#12
quote:
Originally posted by The Hedonist:
Comes down to a simple idea, Sell the custumor what they want
Buy stuff to support a genre? NOPE! You offer, I buy If available
You no gots?? Ok someone else will. Genre going out of bizz?
Too bad so sad, maybe next try at us you get it right.

Someone who wants the profit, will match the consumers demands.

EOD

True, but the consumers often have different demands - some might want RPGS, some might want the multi-path, multi ending type of games and so on. Peach Princess are trying to meet the consumer demand (by offering a game like Brave soul, for example, since the demand for an RPG seems to be quite high) - but at the same time, they have to offer a variety in their products, just like any other company to "test" just how successful the product in question would be. The companies in Japan does this kind of thigs, too; a company whose "speciality" is to create just the multi-path, multi-ending type of games may still try to do a different kind of game, maybe a SIM or an RPG now and then just to test if they'd be more successful if they did that - and at the same time, they might make some of the consumers who plays this SIM or RPG they created interested in their other games as well, just like a japanese may produce onlt the kikuchi kind of bishoujo games to suddenly try to make a pure love game for the same reasons as above.

Besides, you don't need to sound so furious ^^;;;. They're after all only suggesting that we buys their product, but it's in the end our own choice. But if the genre isn't supported and no demand shown then the japanese comapnies will lose their interest in the english bishoujo gaee market - and that would also mean the end of our possibity to demand anything at all. You could think like this: Buy to support the genre for now, and worry about the "demand" later when they're an established (did I spell it right?) bussines accepted by the Japanese companies. When they are, then we can discuss the "demand" issuse further [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

[This message has been edited by Spectator Beholder (edited 02-05-2002).]

#13
quote:
Originally posted by The Hedonist:


I must take issue th'o with your take on the sexual content of these games.. (without seeing it yet), like most stories written or taped, it is the writers vision which moves the storie. Sex in a storie like these may just seem to make the game more true to life, as I seem to member we do have it! [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/wink.gif[/img]

Hi Hedonist, I'm sorry if I conveyed the impression that I don't like the sexual content in the game. I said the general perception is Bishoujo games invariably contain sexual content, and the media as well as the 'Tokimemo' fans have met this with obstinate resistance, without giving Bishoujo games with adult situation the deserved evaluation. Ironically, I've talked with some fans who want unedited, original anime with original Japanese voices yet wholesale reject adult situations in Bishoujo games and insist that they be stripped so that they be 'appropriate'. If we want to lobby these Bishoujo game fans in this niche market, it would do well to first convince them of the merits that they have overlooked and convert them over to our camp.

#14

Quote
Buy to support the genre for
now, and worry about the “demand” later when they’re an established (did I spell it right?) bussines
accepted by the Japanese companies. When they are, then we can discuss the “demand” issuse further

Ouote Off
You don’t get the point… This is the point:
I won’t just spend my money to “support” a genre. If there is a product in the genre that I want, all well and good. Buy it just to keep a company (any company this is not just peapri ) in the Biz… NOT A CHANCE…
Make products I want, I’ll buy…

there is no one I know who is going buy something they can’t use just to support a genre…I know I’m not that rich, If you are you can buy it and send it to me !

Rog

Eveyone, thanks for your well tought-out replies on this, I think that this is really
what the internet should be about…

[This message has been edited by The Hedonist (edited 02-05-2002).]

#15

I don’t think it is compulsory for people to purchase a story they don’t like, but the greater problem is many people are playing the Bishoujo games from pirate sources and ripped CDs. There’s a lot of them on eBay.

#16
quote:
Originally posted by bokmeow:
I don't think it is compulsory for people to purchase a story they don't like, but the greater problem is many people are playing the Bishoujo games from pirate sources and ripped CDs. There's a lot of them on eBay.

Like any crime, they should be arrested and charged , in this case with theft. There will allways be poeple who are crooked, be it games or used cars. nature of the human .. Once you accept that and relise that you cant change that it becomes less of a issue. Does it hurt real sale? I'm not sure that it has any effect. Take a look at the person that would buy a stolen game. would that person get that game if wasn't free or close to it? most likely not, so, if they would'nt ever buy for real,
how can you count it as a lost sale.. there would have never been a sale in the first place.

Rog

#17

Accessibility is the key, if serial codes and pirate games weren’t accessible, yes, they would buy the games, because some people, when given the temptation, will head for the reach out rather than making a purchase. If you could just drive away with a ‘free’ car withou causing much disturbance, many given the option will take the free car rather than buying a car. If price was a contention, can you make the same argument for a paperback book? Why do some people take a free download of a novel, or decide to take a ‘five-finger discount’? This is not an easy problem to tackle, and the lack of participant observation makes it especially problematic, but there is some literature that I can point you to that discusses theft and property crime, which is still applicable to electronic theft.

[This message has been edited by bokmeow (edited 02-05-2002).]

#18
quote:
Originally posted by bokmeow:
Accessibility is the key, if serial codes and pirate games weren't accessible, yes, they would buy the games, because some people, when given the temptation, will reach for a handout rather than making a purchase. If you could just drive away with a 'free' car withou causing much disturbance, many given the option will take the free car rather than buying a car. If price was a contention, can you make the same argument for a paperback book? Why do some people take a free download of a novel, or decide to take a 'five-finger discount'? This is not an easy problem to tackle, and the lack of participant observation makes it especially problematic, but there is some literature that I can point you to that discusses theft and property crime, which is still applicable to electronic theft.

[This message has been edited by bokmeow (edited 02-05-2002).]

#19

Accessibility is the key, if serial codes and pirate games weren’t accessible, yes, they would buy the games, because some people, when given the temptation, will head for the reach out rather than making a purchase. If you could just drive away with a ‘free’ car withou causing much disturbance, many given the option will take the free car rather than buying a car. If price was a contention, can you make the same argument for a paperback book? Why do some people take a free download of a novel, or decide to take a ‘five-finger discount’? This is not an easy problem to tackle, and the lack of participant observation makes it especially problematic, but there is some literature which I can point you to that discusses theft and property crime, which is still applicable to electronic theft.

#20

First, Hedonist, sorry. I detected some anger in your post following mine, so I apologize. I didn’t want to insinuate anything when I wrote “.wmv” was a standard, just stating a fact.

Also, I think there’s 2 levels (though “level” isn’t probably the right word) when talking abut “promoting” any thing. The first level (ours; well most of ours ) is that of hardcore fans, who’d try to promote the genre at any cost. The second (yours apparently) is that of the genuine user, who would only buy games which would appeal to him.
None are right; the industry needs both IMO. It’s just that at the present time us hardcore fans have more “work” to do…