What kind of PR image should Bishoujo games portray?

Visual Novel Community Archive, 2000-2009
#1

OK, I want to ask the big big big big big (and another big!) question: What PR image should Bishoujo games portray? You all know why this is important and why we should be very interested in shaping it, because right now the available English localizations of Bishoujo game titles are mostly with some amount of H-content. This Bishoujo game audience is one of the more loyal ones, which is often the case for niche, under appreciated things in the world. I can cite the early Star Trek fans, the NeoGeo fan community, the Conan O’Brien entourage in his first 3 years or so, as positive proof of loyal audiences for niche cultures. The fans of Bishoujo games seem to be divided into two separate camps at the moment, one that are staunch supporters of the English localization titles from Jast USA, Peach Princess, G-Collections, and Himeya Soft because this group are [mostly] of legal age and are more accepting of material with adult content, yet most of those who are asked, ‘What do you look for in a Bishoujo game?’ story and characters are still the predominant reasons that this group plays Bishoujo games. That is certainly not to say the H-content is an insignificant factor, yet story and characters eclipses H-content when it comes down to swaying one’s purchase decision.

The other camp consists possibly of all ages, and learns about Bishoujo games primarily through hearsay, perhaps even possibly through Teh Romz. This camp’s eagerness for Sakura Taisen, Tokimeki Memorial, To Heart, Comic Party, Kanon, Air, all these popular all ages titles is widely known. Some members of this camp can even be very whiny and demands there be some resolution for Japanese game companies to localize these titles, for Teh rabid fans insist upon the righteousness of their vision. We are probably well aware of this type, I have personally met a lot of this type of individuals at conventions, BBS’s, as well as had a few of them as friends. The greatest irony of it all is most of these individuals [probably] know zero Japanese, and play these games, should they manage to obtain them, through the aid of someone else’s translation. Being a fan is a great thing, because you are willing to sacrifice great amounts of time, energy, and sometimes even money, to produce something for someone else’s benefit. One could say the great following for these titles tantamouts to spectators of a sports conference, in which you don’t have to play the game in order to enjoy watching it.

There is no way to convince the non-adult Bishoujo game group the merits of Bishoujo games with adult content because it is illegitimate to do so. and I believe the Bishoujo game fans have self-deluded themselves long enough that they should start waking up. If the Bishoujo game market needs to succeed and flourish, some serious campaign effort needs to be created, hear what people like and want, and pander to those basal needs.

#2

The image we portray to the Japanese companies is shown in sales figures. We can say story, story, story till we are blue in the face. Sales aren’t showing this or Kana would have sold out first, not Kango. Personally I liked them both. I would be interrested in knowing how Casual Romance Club is doing outside Japan. I would love for all the ported games to have great stories, but our fellow consumers aren’t sending this message. Lots of easily accessible unmosaiced sex is what is selling the best. I will be very interrested in how Brave Soul does, as many gamers like rpgs.

#3

I think Peach Princess and Jast USA should start putting together a reader response card for people to send back to the company. The biggest flaw of my survey was the small sample size, and those who were willing to come forward and fill out the survey. Probably a lot of people wouldn’t even give me the time of day because they were too lazy to. I don’t think asing people to pay a nominal first class postage is too much to ask, many a companies are doing this.

#4

I don’t know how much response they will get from the reply cards. Most people just toss them in the garbage once they open the game. Only the most devoted people will send out reply cards. And they already know what the answers are just by looking at our posts

#5

Dun kid yourself there, most ppl buy bishoujo games based on the amount of erotic CGs inside. Just look at the immense popularity enjoyed by the Viper series, if sales are dependant primarily on stories Hobibox would have gone bankrupt long time ago. >_< Afterall bishoujo games are not commonly known as hentai games w/o a reason, most ppl consider it on par with strip poker.

Don’t get me wrong here, I’m for story as well when buying, but I think it’s wrong to assume that most buyers go for stories just because some forumers who are quite vocal post on the board. It is my belief that ppl who buy h-games for the “booty” won’t even bother discussing such topics in the forum. My 2c, hope nobody’s offended.

#6

i think angry gamer has a good point…especially in america, most people consider bishoujo games to be porn and nothing but, so most who buy the games do so for the H-scenes and the game’s…um…"stroke factor"

and these people are also not likely to be very vocal about their perverse pleasures (as perceived by most of society)…i hate to say it, but i believe the fans on this board are probably the minority, which is why the games with lots of H-content sell better than story-oriented

i had an ex-boyfriend tell me once that he didn’t understand why i played the bishoujo games i did, with heavy story, because he considered it ‘porn that takes too much effort’, as opposed to the ‘instant gratification’ most americans are used to in their adult content

#7

Hmm, I’d like to clear up one thing though. I don’t think any of us are kidding ourselves over the fact that we’re mainly a minority here, that most other people are going for the erotic content. Most of us have been interested in the genre long enough to know this. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try to change popular perception about the games.

And by “popular perception” I’m also included “common knowledge”. (And I think that’s part of what we’re discussing.) After all, “common knowledge” says that these games are only available via download, are all about sex, and are played exclusively by perverted guys. We know that none of that is true, but ask around and those are some of the things people really do believe about these games. PR isn’t solely about swaying opinions, it also includes disseminating knowledge.

#8
quote:
Originally posted by wanfu2k1:
I don't know how much response they will get from the reply cards. Most people just toss them in the garbage once they open the game. Only the most devoted people will send out reply cards. And they already know what the answers are just by looking at our posts [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/tongue.gif[/img]

I want to address this statement by saying it's a fatalist response. Haven't we all heard people say 'Companies don't care about the fans?' I think a reader response card is a good way of showing that the company invites people's responses. One may argue, 'if they would do that, they would write the company anyways, by email or by snail mail.' But the truth is, sometimes you have to offer a bone for people to chew on. Reader response cards may cost less than an unmosaiced experiment of Critical Point. (I don't know if it really is cheaper, because you have to print a lot in order for printers to actually print them, or give you a discount.)

#9

I personally think the translating companies hurt the image of bishoujo games in their advertisements…it seems like most of them, when posting screenshots of the game for prospective buyers, focus only on the H-scene pictures, instead of more gameplay/character pictures, for example…i mean, even Kana from G-collections…there are only a few H-scenes in the whole game, yet half their graphics page has H-scene pictures…another good example is Private Nurse…i played the game quite a few times and there is much more to the game than H-scenes, but the entirety of the graphics page is all sex, no content

how is anyone supposed to get the idea that most of these games are not solely about sex when that is all the companies show to prospective buyers?

[This message has been edited by ladyphoenix (edited 05-22-2003).]

#10

Of course you also have to realize that these companies want to sell as many copies of their product as they can. And if the large majority of the people buy it because of the H content then by showing those pictures you pique these people interest. If you just post the non H pictures and a overview of the story they would lose those customers that buy it purely for the H content. The companies are just doing what it has to do, promoting it in the best way to maximize sales.

#11
quote:
Originally posted by ladyphoenix:
how is anyone supposed to get the idea that most of these games are not solely about sex when that is all the companies show to prospective buyers?

I'm hoping the reviews will counteract that. Personally, retailers should just present a story synopsis and describe what genre the game is, as well as define the genre. Unicorn and I have discussed this a bit, and we think hammering out a universally accepted set of definitions for the game genres will be beneficial.

[This message has been edited by bokmeow (edited 05-22-2003).]

#12
quote:
Originally posted by ekylo:
Hmm, I'd like to clear up one thing though. I don't think any of us are kidding ourselves over the fact that we're mainly a minority here, that most other people are going for the erotic content. Most of us have been interested in the genre long enough to know this. Doesn't mean we shouldn't try to change popular perception about the games.

And by "popular perception" I'm also included "common knowledge". (And I think that's part of what we're discussing.) After all, "common knowledge" says that these games are only available via download, are all about sex, and are played exclusively by perverted guys. We know that none of that is true, but ask around and those are some of the things people really do believe about these games. PR isn't solely about swaying opinions, it also includes disseminating knowledge.


Sorry if I had sounded offensive, I wasn't refering to anyone in particular. It's more of an observation from a lurker around the boards: There are many (not yourself prehaps) who really kid themselves that most buyers buy b-games to appreciate the stories. They usually classify audiences into 2 camps: 1)ppl who know exactly what b-games are and buy them because they do consider it as adult-themed rather than the usual American hardcore porn 2)ppl who misunderstand the b/h genere and therefore consider it a waste of time as there are better and faster porn around.

I was actually trying to say that there exists a 3rd camp: ppl who treat b-games as a subset of porn much like other fetish such as bondage, orgy etc... It is my opinion that these ppl are aware of story-based games but choose to buy the more "hentai" ones because they consider it as "porn fetish".

Past sales have shown that camp3 form the largest market share. Therefore I feel that as fans of story-based games, we should of course try to spread the word around that appreciation of b-games are much more than erotic CGs. (Good work on the various b-game reviews webmaster/mistress!) BUT there's a difference b/w comapnies and fans: the PR image potrayed by companies should follow strictly on sales figures and market potential.

From a profit point of view, I would suggest co. target camp3 consumers in their advertising and PR. It is only when b-games have gained a strong foothold in the market can they start venturing into other areas like our story-based b-games. Afterall, it's definitely much easier to plaster erotic CGs around to attract camp3 then slowly tone down the porn element and emphaisise on plot settings explaining and convincing camp2 to join most of us here (camp1).

Sex sells - this is the cold hard truth surrounding any entertainment industry and b-games is no exception. The industry is still very much in infancy and primary focus should be on surviving and gaining market foothold.

#13

On other words, it’s a matter of what part of the body PP should concentrate on. First, we have the head, and that’s us; we are the eyes, mouth, voice, brain, etc of the b-game market and thne there’s the rest of the body; which are the people who doesn’t think too much of the story aspects of the game, but think it’s fun nonetheless, but who in general buy the games more for the sex than the story…

#14
quote:
Originally posted by Angry Gamer:

Sorry if I had sounded offensive, I wasn't refering to anyone in particular. It's more of an observation from a lurker around the boards: There are many (not yourself prehaps) who really kid themselves that most buyers buy b-games to appreciate the stories.

Actually, you didn't sound offensive. But you also aren't the first to make the observation that we (the regulars here) sound like we're deluding ourselves to the realities of the situation. I've gotten a little tired of that, so that's why I made my comment. (So if I sounded irked, it wasn't just from what you said, it's just been building up for a bit.) I know we do sound a bit deluded in our arguments, but when you talk to any hardcore fans about their particular subject, they usually sound deluded in some way.

Hmm, I can understand what your saying about how we sometimes sound like we classify people into two camps (the old "them or us" classificiation system) and the existance of a third "camp". But I also feel it's a bit too much of a simplification of a complex situation, I don't like those. A good example would be that X-Change thread from a few months back. A few people were arguing that the reason X-Change was the top seller was because of it's high sex content compared to the other titles. In that thread, I know I probably sounded like I was denying the validity of that point of view. In actuality, I never denied that the high erotic content wasn't a major force in X-Change's sales, what I did do was point out several other potential factors involved in addition to that, factors that people might not have even considered.

Hmm, but to slide back on-topic, to me, I really don't know how they should PR the games. That's why I'm not a marketing anaylist, I'm just a computer geek. My preference would be the ephasize the story aspect, but you're right, that probably won't help sales as much as focusing on the adult content. Won't stop me from arguing the story side to people though... [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/wink.gif[/img]

#15

There’s what we would like to believe, and then there’s the reality. The reality is that most people are in it for the h-scenes. So that’s how the games will be played up.

That said, I think SOME emphasis needs to be put on the story portion of the games, else those few true otaku among us won’t ever find out that the games actually have stories and plots (well, some do) and characters.

So I suppose the way they’re doing it now is working well enough, but if they emphasised the non-h parts more I’d be happy.

#16
quote:
Originally posted by Nandemonai:
So I suppose the way they're doing it now is working well enough, but if they emphasised the non-h parts more I'd be happy.

I agree, but on the other hand, I prefer rather the companies staying in business with acceptable sales figures than doing an idealistic but self-destructive act for us story-lovers.

Just the same happened when Peter asked me about a week ago to comment on the passages regardin G-Collections games in the draft of JAST's new product-catalog:
I made a comment and he made an according amendment but also had to add our beloved 'h'-word in this new sentence. I complained to him about that, but I also told in my complaint that I realize the catalog is supposed to sell the games and thus I didn't object to it at all.

#17
quote:
Originally posted by Unicorn:
I agree, but on the other hand, I prefer rather the companies staying in business with acceptable sales figures than doing an idealistic but self-destructive act for us story-lovers.

Just the same happened when Peter asked me about a week ago to comment on the passages regardin G-Collections games in the draft of JAST's new product-catalog:
I made a comment and he made an according amendment but also had to add our beloved 'h'-word in this new sentence. I complained to him about that, but I also told in my complaint that I realize the catalog is supposed to sell the games and thus I didn't object to it at all.

I understand that...I didn't mean he should go from "pushing all h" to "pushing all romance", that just wouldn't work; we haven't got enough fans who like that sort of thing to rely on that yet.

I just meant the promotional material should be like 80/20 or so.

---

On an unrelated note, here's a thought--marketing pushes the h parts more because it's something that's easy to write up in a marketing piece. Describing complex character interactions is hard to do in a marketing piece, so you can't really describe the romantic parts and make them as appealing as the naughty bits. I've run into this problem with getting people to watch Haibane Renmei; these people didn't like Lain, so I had to pretty much sit them down and make them watch the first episode. (They were hooked after that, of course, it's a good show.)

#18
quote:
Originally posted by Nandemonai:

On an unrelated note, here's a thought--marketing pushes the h parts more because it's something that's easy to write up in a marketing piece. Describing complex character interactions is hard to do in a marketing piece, so you can't really describe the romantic parts and make them as appealing as the naughty bits. I've run into this problem with getting people to watch Haibane Renmei; these people didn't like Lain, so I had to pretty much sit them down and make them watch the first episode. (They were hooked after that, of course, it's a good show.)

Ah... who can forget Lain & Haibane Renmei ;-) FYI there's a new series by the same director named <> while defeinitely more on the mature side (sex & gore), it still retains the unique style of presenting an idea and sombre mood one sees in Lain. Check it out if you have time! [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/wink.gif[/img]

#19
quote:
Originally posted by Angry Gamer:
Ah... who can forget Lain & Haibane Renmei ;-) FYI there's a new series by the same director named <> while defeinitely more on the mature side (sex & gore), it still retains the unique style of presenting an idea and sombre mood one sees in Lain. Check it out if you have time! [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/wink.gif[/img]


Shit, the title got recognized as a tag.... Anyway, I was refering to "Texhnolyze" from the makers of Serial Experiment Lain & Haibane Renmei. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

#20
quote:
Originally posted by Angry Gamer:

Shit, the title got recognized as a tag.... Anyway, I was refering to "Texhnolyze" from the makers of Serial Experiment Lain & Haibane Renmei. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

You can edit your posts, you know...I believe [] work just fine.