Thoughts on V-Mate

quote:
Originally posted by Vaga42Bond:
1: I'm not a company represntative. I'm an employee, and a proof-reader at that, but I'm no company represntative. That bit on slamming the NNVOHOIAD FAQ was mostly to correct some of the details and add some key points. As it is, the only thing really offical about it was I was allowed time to do it at work, and that I got the information straight from management.

Obviously you never took business law in college, right? your idea of a "company representative" is an official PR person or someone designated with those duties.

The fact of the matter is that even if your official position at the company is "proofreader," the actions you took on behalf of GC regarding VM at this board (i.e. writing up your unofficial faq w/ heavy borrowing of someone else's work) is legally deemed to be GC's position on VM. You yourself just said you used company time to add key points to the floating faq, and information comes from management. These two facts make your faq official in fact. (unless GC posts an anouncement disavowing all knowledge of your faq, and that your faq is the product of a rogue employee; and then comes out with its own announcement/faq for VM.) It is also a fact that your official faq plagiarized someone else's work, and GC is legally responsible for your plagiarization.

Frankly, this asinine actitude of yours pissed me even more, Vaga. THE HELL WITH YOU AND WITH ALL G-COLL STAFF. You can be sure that with or without V-Mate G-Coll will never get a single cent more from me.

Lamuness: well you know what i did. thanks to an italian informant for this.

[This message has been edited by Lamuness (edited 10-31-2004).]

quote:
Originally posted by Vaga42Bond:
The ammount of questions that was being asked was getting out of hand. I added a little blurb giving a bit more credit in just now, and edited it a little. I'll probably add more of a blurb as soon as I'm less cranky about things.
And the questions about V-Mate will continue to get out of hand with no new answers but lots of new questions. I also hope you are not cranky at us and can for just a moment pretend you aren't working at that company and are once again merely one of us.
quote:
Originally posted by Vaga42Bond:I'm not here 24-7. If you haven't notice, I'm not usually here during the weekend. And weekends for me start from Thursday Evenings to Tuesday Mornings. Guess what? I don't see anything during that weekend, unless I happen to wander by, like right now.

This is another problem, G-Collections has a company "mouthpiece" that takes a four day weekend and have no one else come during that time to speak with us. Also they either give no information to their "mouthpiece" or their "mouthpiece" has so little to offer and thus at least appears to ignore our questions such as the patch and what current games they are selling would have a patch if those games had been released under the V-Mate system.

Though if it is possible I hope you, Vaga42Bond, could ask them about the patch question I and others have asked (noted above) and at least tell us you have asked and they have said nothing yet, because for right now even if there is no choice and you are following company policy it reflects poorly on both yourself and on them, actually perhaps even suggest to them a new "mouthpiece" as some of us are starting to turn on you as G-Collections representative.

[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 10-30-2004).]

quote:
Originally posted by SCDawg:
Though if it is possible I hope you, Vaga42Bond, could ask them about the patch question I and others have asked (noted above) and at least tell us you have asked and they have said nothing yet, because for right now even if there is no choice and you are following company policy it reflects poorly on both yourself and on them, actually perhaps even suggest to them a new "mouthpiece" as some of us are starting to turn on you as G-Collections representative.

[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 10-30-2004).]


Considering how frequently the patch issue has come up in our discussions, and the latest GC position is that the patch will be issued within one year after production ends, I don't foresee any additional announcements on this patch issue unless GC changes its position again.

Second, Vaga has already said he's a proofreader and doesn't see himself as an official GC rep. I don't know if GC management agrees with that stance; it could have rather easy for GC management to say to Vaga, "you are forbidden from posting at PP bbs." But even assuming that GC sees Vaga as the "mouthpiece" and how poorly we are reacting to his posts, I don't think GC would be inclined to appoint another "mouthpiece." Who would be willing to take up this thankless job? And aside from a proofreader, where else would they pull a worker to enlist? not programming/debugging. not shipping/order fulfillment. not translating.

[This message has been edited by Ecchifan (edited 10-30-2004).]

At this point, I don’t see a reason to continue on discussing VM at these boards. And I will go back to lurker mode like before. if you wish to continue discussing with me, I invite you to email me and we’ll talk privately.

Yes, I agree. There really isn’t any point to continue talking about this. V-mate is here and that’s it. It’s not a complicated issue. Just decide for yourself if v-mate will be too much of a hassle then don’t buy GC games anymore. For me, a connection to the internet is not a problem at all, nor is the fact that I can’t sell the games since I don’t sell them anyway. It’s a pain, but I like bishoujo games and these are not major issues for me. So it’s a case-by-case basis.

quote:
Originally posted by Ecchifan:
Second, Vaga has already said he's a proofreader and doesn't see himself as an official GC rep. I don't know if GC management agrees with that stance; it could have rather easy for GC management to say to Vaga, "you are forbidden from posting at PP bbs." But even assuming that GC sees Vaga as the "mouthpiece" and how poorly we are reacting to his posts, I don't think GC would be inclined to appoint another "mouthpiece." Who would be willing to take up this thankless job? And aside from a proofreader, where else would they pull a worker to enlist? not programming/debugging. not shipping/order fulfillment. not translating.
They placed him as spokesperson, albeit they provide him with a little information for which full blame is placed upon them since, as he mentioned in another thread, he does talk to them about our concerns and of course no blame is placed on him since he is only the spokesperson and is passing on our concerns. I blame them alone for this lack of information.

Also to me at least that issue of a patch, if any one issue, becomes more important with V-Mate out.

As to who else they should (could) also pull to talk to us, well how about they atually pull someone from their Customer Service office, after all it is their first priority.

And obviously I am still for talking about this here since the patch has become much more of an issue then ever before with V-Mate out and am not for the wait and see idea but if neither of you want to that is your choice as it is mine to continue to push for an example about the patch and more information about the patch.

[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 10-30-2004).]

quote:
Originally posted by Ecchifan:
Obviously you never took business law in college, right? your idea of a "company representative" is an official PR person or someone designated with those duties.

The fact of the matter is that even if your official position at the company is "proofreader," the actions you took on behalf of GC regarding VM at this board (i.e. writing up your unofficial faq w/ heavy borrowing of someone else's work) is legally deemed to be GC's position on VM. You yourself just said you used company time to add key points to the floating faq, and information comes from management. These two facts make your faq official in fact. (unless GC posts an anouncement disavowing all knowledge of your faq, and that your faq is the product of a rogue employee; and then comes out with its own announcement/faq for VM.) It is also a fact that your official faq plagiarized someone else's work, and GC is legally responsible for your plagiarization.


Couldn't have said it better myself. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

quote:
Originally posted by Lamuness:
now guys, calm down.....peter is only writing this from a company's point of view and "from what he was told" (i think, and i must stress those quotation marks).

at any rate, as far as i know, peach princess currently has no plans for using vmate for our games in the near future....well, at least not for our next game little my maid. so i hope that answers some of your concerns. of course we will be watching how this sytem will turn out in terms of sales and customer reactions, and only time will tell. we may be a slowpoke at releasing games, but at least we are careful, cautious...and honest :P


Ya know I wouldn't mind AT ALL if Peapri implemented V-mate, because I KNOW they WOULD impliment the patch before the 12th of never. The only reason I'm pissed at GC is because they WILL NOT give us a DATE! For god sakes if they said "in 3 years" I would be happy.

Wow. It took me forever to read this thread and the other one with 24 pages. Well it seems that this V-mate discussion has become even more heated than the presidential election. So far I see that this V-mate is more trouble than what its worth. The only plus side I see in this is that games are cheaper and more are coming here sooner. Also, I believe that Pirates WILL break the system. Thats a given because no matter how secure it is, it does have a flaw. I’ve seen pirates able to make modchips to mess with Xbox’s PS2s and an whole assortment of other things including banking systems, encrypted disks ect… This system won’t be that hard to break since its connected to the internet. The only known system that I know that is impossible to crack is Paypal.

[This message has been edited by tiger_of_the_wind2040 (edited 10-31-2004).]

I cannot remember if it was here or elsewhere, but someone said that anything made by humans is inherently as flawed as the human(s) that made it and all things made by humans are flawed because they are made by humans. On that note I have heard rumors it already has been cracked, will only say on this that the rumor comes third or fourth hand through people who monitor such stuff under the theory that the only one that might be able to someday stop pirates is someone who once was a pirate (the old “it takes a theif” theory).

Anyway, my main concern, at this moment, is the patch, but there is a lot else that I don’t like about this system especially considering it is a big hindrance to the legal customer and if the rumor is true it is a big hindrance to the legal customer that will already fail to work as advertised and not have the ‘benefit’ of slowing down the pirates.

[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 10-31-2004).]

quote:
Originally posted by SCDawg:
I cannot remember if it was here or elsewhere, but someone said that anything made by humans is inherently as flawed as the human(s) that made it and all things made by humans are flawed because they are made by humans. On that note I have heard rumors it already has been cracked, will only say on this that the rumor comes third or fourth hand through people who monitor such stuff under the theory that the only one that might be able to someday stop pirates is someone who once was a pirate (the old "it takes a theif" theory).

Anyway, my main concern, at this moment, is the patch, but there is a lot else that I don't like about this system especially considering it is a big hindrance to the legal customer and if the rumor is true it is a big hindrance to the legal customer that will already fail to work as advertised and not have the 'benefit' of slowing down the pirates.

[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 10-31-2004).]


Many people in history had said this, nothing new. The only way that is close too 100% secure (I do mean close), its made from alien technology. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

quote:
Originally posted by Hogi Bear:
The only way that is close too 100% secure (I do mean close), its made from alien technology. :)

Actually aliens have IT security just as bad as most earthlings. Ever seen Independence Day? Think of the crux of the plot in that film. It takes an Earth 1337 hax0r all of a few hours to whip up a virus for an alien system he's never seen before - that cripples the entire mothership? Come on, that has "Microsoft" written all over it.

quote:
Originally posted by Nandemonai:
Actually aliens have IT security just as bad as most earthlings. Ever seen Independence Day? Think of the crux of the plot in that film. It takes an Earth 1337 hax0r all of a few hours to whip up a virus for an alien system he's never seen before - that cripples the entire mothership? Come on, that has "Microsoft" written all over it.


And I do believe that the virus was written on an iMac no less.

quote:
Originally posted by Hogi Bear:
Many people in history had said this, nothing new. The only way that is close too 100% secure (I do mean close), its made from alien technology. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/smile.gif[/img]
Well since G-Collections cannot afford such technology I wonder what their next attempt will be, that is if they survive this one.

quote:
Originally posted by Hogi Bear:

And I do believe that the virus was written on an iMac no less.

No. Probably that was not a Virus. They installed Win95 as the OS for the entire ship. [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

And just my .02 cents:
That flaw on the Alien Starship in ID4 was more human than you guys think...

Did someone here ever watched the old/classic Anime-TV Series, USHIUU SENKAN YAMATO (STARBLAZERS), more precisely, the Empire Comet saga? That's exactly the way how Yamato defeated the Empire Comet. In other words, ID4 plagiarized Yamato!!

Thanks for everyone’s comments. I finally got my copy of the game, and the V-Mate system worked just fine – I didn’t think it was a problem to do the registration process, especially since the registration doesn’t need to be repeated with future games (the password, etc. is already entered). Subsequent loading of the game were 100% seamless, and you can keep the program open without the connection (although I didn’t try it on a laptop, this should work too).

I would hope – hope! – that some of the people who are not happy with the V-Mate system could see it in their hearts to try this first release and see for themselves how much extra trouble they consider the system. If you don’t like it, send an email to GC about it and don’t buy any further games. Really, while I know people are passionate about having control over things on their systems, I believe that this system could be good for b-games by increasing sales. While I’m still officially in the dark as to exactly when a patch releasing the V-Mate system will be released, I can almost promise that fans need not worry about it not appearing. They are good people and are just trying to do what they need to to drop there being 500 pirates for every paying customer, a situation that will eventually lead to their demise if nothing is done.

Yes you can keep the same password unless you sell when you need to input a new id and password for each game if you sell each of your former games. Is PP against the exposure they might get through such resells too? In fact if I was ever to try the game a 10 dollar resold version is the only way I would ever consent to considering trying a V-Mate game.

I cannot say G-Collections is not working behind the scenes but if they are, they are not being open about it and that too is a major concern of many people on this board lack of open communication. Yet even when a statement is made by G-Collections it is vague enough to mean anything they want it to mean and is vague enough to have the meaning altered at their whim such as end of sales could mean when they raise the price (if they do), or when the game is no longer being sold or when the game is no longer being made but the last of the stock is still being sold, or when they go out of business, or countless other possibilities.

If that statement of almost promise had come from them I would be pissed. Almost promise is like almost pregnant it is does not exist, a promise is either one or it is not and I know Peter cannot make a promise for another company, which is why G-Collections themselves needs to come out and give everyone something far more fixed then they have in the past and do so very soon in my opinion.

You know if a company needs to do this restriction of customers various controls over their own system in order to survive I really don’t think they will survive granted that is perhaps a very personal opinion. Yes yes I know as of now no plans for PP to have this or anything like it in place yet at the same time Peter seems more and more interested if not eager for this or something like this system which concerns me greatly as I think it will only encourage piracy among the less scruplous that don’t like this system and would have bought without it in place. Actually have studies been done on this? All the studies seem to have been how much it could decrease piracy, has anyone done a comparative study about how much it could increase piracy? Or are they so convinced their infallible system is truly unbreachable and infallible that the need for such a study was never seen?

Also does anyone within PP know as an indisputable fact if this V-Mate has already increased G-Collections b-games sales so far as sales have gone with this game? If no one does know if it has or has not, then it is a very dangerous assumption to continually figure it will increase sales as in the American market I see it being the end of some sales and the start of far more pirating since I still say a bulk of the former pirates were underage and could not buy it legally if it was buy it legally or be shot.

Additionally, I am curious if the statement about ‘people being passionate about having control over things on their system’ means you feel we should not have control over things on our own systems and eventually turn things over to the companies who act as mini Big Brothers telling us to a point, when, how, and if we can play the games we legally bought from them? Perhaps that last comment is a bit extreme about the mini-Big Brothers but at least in my eyes that is what V-Mate is either in practice or the start of if PP also grabs on to this idea.

Apologies for the slight rant but the fact PP is showing some more or at least implict interest in this system as me very worried that Little My Maid might be the last game I ever get from them or this entire industry, should such a system be put into action for games after that one.

[This message has been edited by SCDawg (edited 11-03-2004).]

for gc sales, even if we know we are not in a position to reveal it to you guys, especially when it’s gc sales and not our own games…

all we are trying to say is that we dont want to immediately condemn vmate’s system, at least not yet. it’s never a good idea to trash anything fully because while it may be a bad idea to use for one purpose it may prove to be beneficial for some other things, and that’s why we are leaving our options open.

to be really blunt, we have a guinea pig here (gc) for this vmate system, and we just want to see more of the turnout. if it turns out crap, then obviously we will not follow gc’s steps. otherwise if it turns out to be pretty good, then we may look into it more. again, we are just trying to stay open, avoid any condemning comments, and most importantly, observe carefully and not jump to conclusions too quickly.

quote:

I cannot say G-Collections is not working behind the scenes but if they are, they are not being open about it and that too is a major concern of many people on this board lack of open communication.


Yes this makes me irritated as hell when they don't answer us, thats just plain stupid.
No Lamuness the guinea pigs is we the buyers who test this new system for them [img]http://princess.cybrmall.net/ubb/tongue.gif[/img]

[This message has been edited by Thomas (edited 11-03-2004).]